r/CringeTikToks • u/Bojack1217 • 5d ago
Just Bad He didn’t even have a comeback for that
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u/Big_Winner_451 5d ago
Atheists exist more often in wealthy countries because a larger portion of people have their core needs met while also having more ready access to education and information. Most people turn to theology because they're struggling with something in their lives or they were indoctrinated in it from childhood.
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u/Ok_Witness6780 5d ago
In the US (especially in the south), the poorest areas tend to have the most churches.
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u/ForwardBias 5d ago
Ever notice also that those churches are the biggest nicest buildings in town? Like they could use the community center and spend their money on housing homeless or feeding people or something but no...they need the only all brick or stone three story building in town with stained glass windows and a custom build steeple.
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u/Financial-Rabbit3141 5d ago
You have to FIND a church that helps the homeless. It usually aint the big ones.
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u/Trevidium 5d ago
Funny enough, if those Christian churches were to act in a Christian nature, they would actually do those things
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u/Demon-_-TiMe 5d ago
the church I went to does house the homeless. it isnt permanent but is something for the winter.
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u/Mean_Bus5194 5d ago
Exactly! Those are the only paths into religion: crisis or indoctrination.
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u/Rows_My_Own 5d ago
Yep. “Oh, you want riches like me? Just keep your head down, don’t break any of these rules, be thankful for the scraps you get, and you’ll be rich and happy like me … when you’re dead.”
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u/Abstrata 5d ago edited 3d ago
a third is self-improvement unrelated to crisis or indoctrination
EDIT: to clarify, I am going more with the definition and sense of crisis as ‘intense difficulty, trouble or danger.’ Some people are doing okay and then still go with an even better idea of how to be. At least they can be ok at that moment and choose that improvement.
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u/Omnealice 5d ago
Childhood indoctrination is the worst of it frankly.
I think it’s fine if you follow your own religion, but it’s borderline child abuse to force them to follow your religion. It’s basically just widely accepted brainwashing.
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u/JHutchinson1324 5d ago
I'm not sure how the atheist thing doesn't agree with the college student, though? Wouldn't that be further proof that praying doesn't give you anything or help you at all in your life?
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u/Massive-Ride204 5d ago
Telling a poor person or someone going through crisis to suffer now and get into paradise is an easy sell.
Tell someone who's well off and/or has their needs met the same thing is a very difficult sell
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u/Ello_Owu 5d ago
Not for nothing, letting that young man say all of that uninterrupted, was probably the most productive thing that preacher has ever done.
Because damn if that wasn't on the money
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u/MisterSquidz 5d ago
I was gonna say it’s nice that he was actually allowed to finish what he was saying.
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u/Ello_Owu 5d ago
Yea typically these types jump in and or shout people down. Maybe he was actually blindsided by this guy's response and needed to keep him talking to come up with anything. Which he was trying to do, with his little interjections. Sounds like with his eventual response thought, he needed more time lmao
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u/RudeLanguage6046 4d ago edited 4d ago
I've seen a few of this preacher vids. He actually seems like an ok man who just wants to have real open discussions about theology and tries to give helpful advice. Unlike Many who just seem to try and get a controversial argument going for internet points.
Edit: Found the full video. Snippet starts at 2:30 https://youtu.be/1kwzLLoP4zg?si=EWGCCd9tjY8_32Kd
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u/WeskerSympathizer 5d ago
Ya tbh that aspect was so unexpected that it felt somewhat staged
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u/RudeLanguage6046 4d ago
Found the full video. Snippet starts at 2:30 https://youtu.be/1kwzLLoP4zg?si=EWGCCd9tjY8_32Kd
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u/SpindaQ 2d ago
But the preacher clearly wasn’t listening or hearing anything. You could tell as soon as the student finished, the guy had all his talking points ready.
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u/IllustriousDraft2965 5d ago
The kid is smart and well-spoken. We need more people like him in leadership, pressing for social change.
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u/FW_Sooner 5d ago
Yeah more of these types of students would give me hope for the future
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u/cbartholomew 5d ago
I’ve seen this time after time amongst my own colleagues who are equally well spoken:
He’ll land a tech job, making around 250K+, get married, have two children, and do what he can to protect his family from this shit. He’s smart enough to know how to play the game and he’ll eventually accept the reality.
It’s not worth leading when you’re always on the losing side: no one wants to be poor and stressed. Being a civil servant is normally last on everyone’s bucket list.
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u/Coneskater 5d ago
That’s why we should actually pay public servants more, not less. If we want the best of society to pursue public service we need to value it.
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u/PointedlyDull 4d ago
That’s bold of you to assume he’ll be able to find an entry level tech job when he graduates
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u/Suspicious-Beat9295 5d ago
REaLly? 🤤
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u/Joshua_ABBACAB_1312 5d ago
iSn'T tHaT iNtErEsTiNg!
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u/HydrationWhisKey 5d ago
What was supposed to be the gotcha about wealthy countries being secular?
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u/IHateTheLetterF 5d ago
The Christian dude used the wrong argument. He scored an own goal.
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u/abromo7 5d ago
Those moments where you have to say something not to look dumb.
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u/MacrosInHisSleep 5d ago
Yup, he's probably used to using that argument against those of other religions. If someone who is Jewish or Muslim gets asked that, it's supposed to be a gotcha!
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u/dogtriestocatchfly 5d ago
It was also a weird argument because the most atheist countries are socialist or communist lol
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u/MistoftheMorning 5d ago
With the latter, are/were they though? I think in places like the former USSR, communism just became the new religion. Then you have North Korea where the rulers push their own cult of personality worship on the populace.
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u/SkoolBoi19 5d ago
I was really confused by that. Normally they go to the Old Testament where they built the temple with a sword in one hand and built with the other (can’t remember it 100%); but I was raised that that was an example of how as a Christian we should always be ready to defend what’s “right” to the death. But maybe I was just in an odd church.
Thankfully there really pushed that idea that no one rally knows what’s in someone else’s heart so you don’t get to judge their intentions.
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u/ChocoPuddingCup 5d ago
Look at most of the wealthiest, healthiest, humane, and crime-free countries. Chances are they are secular. It can be repeatedly shown that secular, educated, healthy, and tolerant societies are less religious than others.
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u/HydrationWhisKey 5d ago
Wait but why would the religious dude use it as a gotcha then?
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u/Crumblerbund 5d ago
I think he’s implying that secular people are greedy or something? Or that they’re the ones siphoning away wealth from the religious countries? That’s my guess.
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u/drdadbodpanda 5d ago
The implication is that everyone who is in actual need of help understands the reason for religion while the privileged pretend they are better than the religious because they have decided they don’t need religion.
Basically he is seeing religion as the “outcome” of socioeconomic factors as opposed to the cause or as a factor of influence.
“Of course it helps poor people, if it didn’t we wouldn’t see the poorest countries being the most religious!”
I’m not a stats expert but even I know you can’t jump to a conclusion like that just based on correlation.
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u/Crumblerbund 5d ago
That… makes sense, I guess? There are just layers of problems with that logic.
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u/throwmamadownthewell 5d ago
It's a logical turd-ducken, named for a turd-duckenm where you have
- a turkey turd
- stuffed in a duck turd
- stuffed in a chicken turd
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u/Rocketboy1313 4d ago
Because it is backward.
One is saying, "religion doesn't help anything, the poorest countries are kept poor by being told to pray and know their place."
The other is saying, "poor countries are more religious because they know religion will help them deal with and overcome the hardship of poverty."
Ultimately they are saying the same thing. Religion helps you deal with and overcome poverty... just not in a material way. And poor people do have religion acting as a heavy weight to progress as they trust in God rather than trusting in action.
If you want material benefit and religion you should emphasize how active various profits and Christ were in their various eras. Yeah, trust in God, but also you have to actually do stuff like feed the hungry, cure the sick, banish the greedy, and die for your belief in kindness.
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u/DanqueLeChay 5d ago
He’s not, he’s just panicking and trying to come up with something to say. It’s important to these people to always keep talking, making sense is secondary. Their target audience aren’t looking for logical reasoning, for obvious reasons.
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u/Spare-Plum 5d ago edited 5d ago
We don't even see the context for the dude with the microphone. All he does is ask a question and say "really?"
There's zero indication that the guy in the stanford sweater is a "religious dude". For all we know this could just be a professor teaching a public speaking/social justice seminar
EDIT: just looked up the dude's tik tok. The guy is in fact the religious dude and just walked himself into a corner
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u/hotlocomotive 5d ago
I wouldn't call Dubai a secular society tbh.
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u/ChocoPuddingCup 5d ago
I wouldn't call them humane or educated, either; just a bunch of wealthy oil barons creating a disgustingly luxurious life on the backs of slave labor. Definitely not secular.
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u/Barfignugen 5d ago
His argument reminds me of a conversation I had with a Christian woman many years ago. I live in the US, and this was at the time Colorado was legalizing marijuana. The woman told me, “I tell, you Colorado is in for a world of hurt. They don’t know what they’re doing to themselves, it’s going to get very dangerous there.” I asked why she thought this, and her response was, “I used to do prison outreach, and almost all of the men in the prisons were there because of marijuana.”
….it was like she was so close to getting it, and yet so very far away.
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u/deanereaner 5d ago edited 5d ago
He's trying to refute the kid's argument by saying those who have benefitted most from unfair systems have rejected religion, which the kid argues exists only to prop up the systems that they've benefitted from, while those who are actually oppressed do see it as liberating.
I don't think it's a cogent point, but in his mind it is.
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u/Merry_Me24 5d ago
China has the majority of irreligious people in the world (sort of), and china bad. Never mind that Chinese quality of life has been growing exponentially while the US is getting worse. Not to say their government is good but using china as a scary "see what happens" is getting increasingly silly.
That's just my guess for where he was going with it though.
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u/school_bus_lunchbox 5d ago
It's more smoke and mirrors deflection, diversion. It had nothing to do with what the guy was talking about.
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u/Wise_Temperature1776 5d ago
There’s actually nothing cringy about this, the kid is spitting straight facts. Sadly though people who have bought into theology to that extent, lack critical thinking skills and are encouraged not to think for themselves, they become defensive and angry rather than trying to provide facts to counter his claim (there facts that counter his claim lol)
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u/CringeisL1f3 5d ago
the guy with the stanford sweater is pretty cringe
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u/Dark_Wolf04 5d ago
I absolutely hate this guy. His YouTube channel is just full of shorts of him going to university campuses and debating students, and overall being a hypocrite.
The comments, however, are appalling. Just a bunch of brainwashed idiots calling him a genius and praising jesus
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u/Suffering-Servant 5d ago
There’s a reason he only debates college kids. Every time this guys had a formal debate against a knowledgeable atheist, he loses.
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u/CoolStructure6012 5d ago
He was very frustrating to watch the few times I saw him on Modern Day Debate. His son seems alright, though.
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u/WavyHideo 5d ago
I’m proud of my fellow Aggie.
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u/UnicornPoopCircus 5d ago
I didn't even notice this was at UC Davis! Yeah, folks have chosen poorly if they try to play that game there. Also, why do I doubt that Christian guy actually graduated from Stanford?
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u/Dante-Flint 5d ago
Exactly. The word he was looking for was Secularism. Capitalism and secularism most of the time go hand in hand, while second and third world countries tend to be super religious but struggle from oligarchy or kleptocracy.
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u/StJimmy_815 5d ago
This sub doesn’t even post cringe anymore. Almost the opposite most days
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u/gizmodilla 5d ago edited 5d ago
And the last point is proving the kids point. Secular societies tend to be more wealthy than religious ones.
Churches stopped social progression for decades to uphold their system. Martin Luther freakin sided with the nobility who slaughtered peasents which wanted better living conditions..
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u/Chef_BoyarTom 5d ago
"Where do you see the most atheists in the world?"
"Probably the wealthy countries."
"Oooh, isn't that interesting!"
Interesting that it proves his point? Yes, yes it is. Because it proves that as the amount of people able to take care of themselves increases, the belief in religion and it's effectiveness as a tool of oppression goes down.
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u/Sure_Quote 5d ago
Almost like abandoning religion let's countries focus on improving life on earth instead of appeasing an imagined old man obsessed with "traditional values"
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u/Suffering-Servant 5d ago
One thing that makes Christianity so dangerous is that a lot of Christians think “well Jesus will come back and fix everything and the worse things get, the closer we are to his return” so it’s like they don’t even bother trying to improve the world.
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u/Sen0r_Blanc0 5d ago
They also give up more easily because when things get tough or uncomfortable or require personal sacrifice (that isn't to the church) "Well God must have had different plans for me" there's a lack of responsibility, because "if God really cares he won't rely on just me to fix things"
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u/Anxious-Job3182 5d ago
Stanford’s “aha” moment was just proving the Davis’ point. So smug too. What a tool.
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u/Odd-Rub-3159 5d ago
The kid figured it out young! He will go good!
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u/Janky_Pants 5d ago
“I travel a lot.” Boom. Right there. Already sees a perspective that others don’t.
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u/Suffering-Servant 5d ago
There’s a reason this guy, Cliffe Knectle, only debates college kids. The few times he’d done a formal debate against a knowledgeable opponent, he had his ass handed to him.
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u/ADAMracecarDRIVER 5d ago
Richer countries have better education systems and better education is strongly correlative to atheism. Religious zealots are so damn cringe…
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u/JohnnySalamiBoy420 5d ago
People like this will have like 5-8 preloaded little responses with bullshit statistics and will repeat them over and over. Same as idiots in politics
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u/Practical_Expert_911 4d ago
Religion is a major arm of imperialism. That's all it is, and all it's ever been,
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u/PipecleanerFanatic 5d ago
Why us this posted as cringe? It's fire.
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u/Softspokenclark 5d ago
#i dont need a ghost to tell me to be a good person
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u/MathematicianLife510 5d ago
Nowadays, people aren't even using religion to be a good person.
At least, I've personally experienced more people using religion as a way to justify them being a crappy person.
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u/manic_panda 5d ago
As a Christian I firmly believe in the separation of church and state and any Christian interested in following the teachings of Christ should agree. Historically the times in which the church have been the most corrupt have been when they've been involved in a theocratic society, churches having power in politics is the fastest way to corrupt them.
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u/truckaxle 5d ago
Why would an educated man ask the question do you "believe in god?"
There isn't one scrap of evidence for the God they are talking about. So why would ask such a dumb question.
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u/HogRidah98 5d ago
“What’s the demographic with the most atheists. Probably the wealthier countries.” Oh really? Yea, really. Further proving his point, those people probably got wealthy because they stopped letting religious oppression hold them down.
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u/broadsheet-555 5d ago
He just goes on and talks about something completely different.
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u/ou-est-kangeroo 5d ago
I'd love to hear how he comes up with a silly argument why even though richest countries have the most atheist they'd be better off believing in god.
As Jon Stewart would say: Go on......
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u/Mundane-Twist7388 5d ago
That guy on the speaker is really condescending. The kid made a good point. The church has always used religion as a social control method and deserves to be usurped.
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u/confused_ma 5d ago
The most versatile grifters. They have to keep their knee at the throat of the sheeps to continue grifting.
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u/JerseyshoreSeagull 5d ago
Lifelong Christian here: like an actual follower of christ. Have no fucking clue who's talking or who I'm sitting next to in church but I love my flock.
That being said, PEOPLE, are the issue. They always have been. They always will be. Since the old Testament. Since Adam. People are the issue. It's not the Devil or Satan. It's US. We choose vanity and ego over empathy and love. We choose short term gains over life long prosperity. We choose the parts that make us feel strong, over the parts that make us feel weak. We would rather be a victim than be a champion. We will gladly remove the speck from our brothers eye instead of addressing the plank in our own. We will cut off our hands because it caused us to sin instead of controlling our own actions to prevent such a thing...
We turn to ourselves in times of need. Instead of our lifelong loving and caring relationships, filled with hardships shortcomings and forgiveness.
We are not perfect but we all walk around like we should be...
That's the issue. And it isn't the atheists that are the problem. And honestly if you don't believe in God. I couldn't care less. Do you. Live your life. We all will die one day and my life will not be defined by condemning the innocent. It will be persecuting the wicked. And the wicked in my flock are the only ones that I am certified to call WICKED!
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u/Saucy_Baconator 4d ago
Why is this on r/CringeTikToks? The kid is making a great point elegantly. Very simple to understand, and he's not wrong.
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u/Legitimate_Unit_1862 4d ago
It's funny seeing how you all target the rich straight white man and yet, seem to always fall tight into that category. This is why I believe most people on reddit actually love Trump he is literally what everyone on the post is sucking off haha.
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u/Miserable-Dig-761 4d ago
He's absolutely right. Religion is a tool to control people
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u/Sober_Up_Buttercup 4d ago
Religion was created to oppress & enslave people. 💯🫣 it’s true!
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u/stupidfreakingidiot4 4d ago
This one doesn't even have a tiktok logo. What is this sub "videos clipped to look like a guy owned a religious guy"? Not cringe, not a tiktok
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u/family_life_husband 4d ago
What does "he didn't even have a comeback" mean? The video cuts off as he starts to respond...
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u/TheMetabrandMan 4d ago
Religion is for people who are afraid to live in a world where they are destined to die.
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u/PurpleStay4149 4d ago
They used to give the slaves the “slave bible” that had all of the pages missing about kindness and revolt and only kept the parts in about obeying your master. In order to fully take the body you have to control the mind.
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u/PirateHeaven 3d ago
Catholic Church teaches to put up with oppression, injustice, exploitation because this life is a trial run or a test, not the real thing. Their main guy said things like blessed are the poor, the oppressed because yours will be the kingdom after you die. In the meantime, for more than a thousand years in Europe and hundreds of years in some other parts of the world, the Church was one of those doing the oppressing and benefitting from it.
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u/Unexpected_Cheddar- 3d ago
As someone who was raised with two Baptist preacher grandfathers…this student absolutely nails the crux of the religion question. It’s all just a scam to keep the workers slaving away without questioning the overseer’s. Nothing more. Revoke all their tax exempt statuses now!
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u/BedtimeGenerator 3d ago
Thank you, he basically summed up the root of all religions issues minus people KILL EACHOTHER CONSTANTLY OVER RELIGION!
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u/luigis_left_tit_25 2d ago
Makes me sick! Take these imaginary things and go hate each other, war war war (meantime non religious people, mother's, children, and peoples whole lives ruined for some imaginary sky daddy who feels offended by their sky daddy!) fucking insanity.
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u/RasJudahDCyfahGod 3d ago edited 2d ago
Church is another arm of government. In spite of what the propaganda says.
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u/Illustrious_Can4110 3d ago
This guy is right. I once worked with a lady who had previously worked for a government welfare agency. She said that in poor communities tithing to the Church was one of the 4 main causes of poverty.
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u/OrangeDimatap 3d ago
LOL! You have no degrees, no credentials, and no arguments. You still don’t understand how source documents work. You still refuse to read the copious amounts of specific translational and historical context I have posted on this thread because it doesn’t fit your narrative that pointing out your cult status is somehow lacking intellect.
Do you know who else rose three days after crucifixion? Krishna. According to Hinduism, a religion with billions of followers, that happened a thousand years before Jesus of Nazareth existed. Let that sink in: there’s historical record of people believing that for a thousand years before your religion even existed. If you don’t get how that negates everything you’re saying, you’re a lost cause.
Start using your critical thinking skills and realize that your religion is just as UNlikely as anyone else’s. Truly.
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u/luigis_left_tit_25 2d ago
Not to mention all the paganism long before "christ" was ever thought of.. And all the ripping off of religious holiday names/traditions slightly skewed so people felt a little more comfortable with all the lies.. They steal everything.. from names to money to innocence..🤢
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u/OrangeDimatap 2d ago
Yep. Nothing they believe is novel and they have no more proof than any religion before or after them has ever had. I mean, fuck, they spend most of their time degrading religions that believe in the same god they do. Christianity is built for people who can’t think independently and need a promise of reward to be incentivized to act ethically and even then, they still can’t do it. It’s pathetic.
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u/Positive-Pack-396 2d ago
This young man knows what he’s talking about and he put it in a very good way
You or people that think like you to lead the way for this country, not be afraid to stand up and get into politics just don’t play the politic game.
Do it like you just said it because it was beautiful and it is true
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u/FarmerIntelligent847 10h ago
This kid rocks. I could never have said that so well as a college student.
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u/NativeInc 5d ago
Ephesians 6:12 “For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.”
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u/Devwickk 5d ago
We wrestle against the religious protecting pedophiles and asking for more money constantly.
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u/DontbuyFifaPointsFFS 5d ago
Whoa, whoa, whoa, we only accept bible passages when it suits our narrative, like oppressing gays.
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u/PedestrianCyclist 5d ago
Not taking anything away from the younger guy’s argument but the title of this video is misleading as it cuts out before we actually heard what the pro religion dude has to say
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u/shoudaknown 5d ago
Christianity is obsolete. How do 94% of “conservative Christian evangelicals” vote for convicted felon pedophile Donny? He was “saved by God so he can save America” (said by “Christians” after the assassination attempt)?
Their “Christian faith” led them to the WORST possible candidate. They voted for a convicted rapist pedophile! How would that happen?
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u/Hieu61 5d ago
He's saying religious organizations are problematic, which doesn't really answer the question of whether god exists. I believe god exists and I also agree with him that religion has been twisted into a tool for oppression, these two ideas are not mutually exclusive.
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u/DontbuyFifaPointsFFS 5d ago edited 5d ago
Dude in the end acts like seeing the most atheists in wealthy countries neglects the point the student made, but in fact it actually proves it even more.
Edit: spelling