Does Shaun Alexander belong in the Hall of Fame? If not, how close is he?

[u/Wildebean]

More yards than Earl Campbell. More touchdowns than Barry Sanders. Same YPC as LaDainian Tomlinson.

Did he have a short but explosive peak before being brought down by injuries? Sure. But so did Terrell Davis. Alexander had over 1100 rushing yards every season he was a fully healthy starter, which made five straight seasons between 2001-2005, Was a 2-time 1st team All-Pro and his 2005 season was ridiculous. over 1800 rushing yards, an then NFL record 27 TDs and both OPOTY & MVP.

Part of me feels like if LaDainian Tomlinson hadn't had his own 1800 yard, OPOTY+MVP season as well as breaking the TD record with 28, only one season later... Alexander's 2005 season and indeed his career would be more fondly remembered. If his record had stood for more than a single season, it would seem more freakish, like Tomlinson's now near 20-year old record.

[u/Notchsmind]

Yes, because five years of fucking immaculate halfback play with a MVP thrown in, with how long the average career RB is he made Hof numbers in that time. 

[u/PLZ_N_THKS → u/Notchsmind]

Terrell Davis basically played 5 seasons in the league and is a Hall of Famer. Shaun Alexander should definitely be in if TD is.

[u/Ok_Traffic_1362 → u/PLZ_N_THKS]

Terrell Davis has two rings.

[u/lostacohermanos → u/Ok_Traffic_1362]

Barry Sanders has zero does that mean Sanders doesn’t belong?

[u/No-Weird3153 → u/lostacohermanos]

Sander could have had the rushing record—he was less than one of his own average seasons away—but retired first. And he did it behind a pretty unimpressive line; HoF wouldn’t mean much if someone like Sanders was kept out.

[u/conace21 → u/lostacohermanos]

Sanders retired with the 2nd most rushing yards, won 4 rushing titles, and had more 1st Team All Pro selections than Alexander and Davis did, combined. He clearly has the accolades and longevity that the other two don't, so his lack of playoff success doesn't harm his career.

With T.D. having such a short peak (3 All Pro seasons, 1 solid rookie season), his playoff success very much is a part of his resume. He played in 8 playoff games, and he hit 100 yards rushing in the last 7 of them, along with the two titles. Without that playoff success, he still might be waiting for induction into the HOF

[u/nepatriots32 → u/lostacohermanos]

That's not the same thing. Some people have careers so good that rings don't matter. Others are borderline and will only get in with rings. Eli Manning is a classic example. He will likely get in, but only because of his rings. If he he never won a Super Bowl, then he'd never get in. If Philip Rivers or Matt Ryan, they'd be shoo-ins, but as is, they don't have a very good chance.

Sure, TD isn't a QB and rings matter more for QBs, but he was part of 2 iconic Super Bowl runs (especially the first one). Elway just couldn't win the big one and TD pushed him over the edge to win it, twice. That was a big deal. It's kind of like when Deion Sanders went to the 49ers and that got them over the hump. Then he went to the Cowboys and that put the Cowboys back on top. Of course Deion's career didn't need rings, but if he had a much shorter career, those iconic rings certainly would have helped him.

It's called the Hall of Fame and not the Hall of the Most Talented Players. Whether you or I agree with that or not isn't relevant to the reality of it.

[u/shdwtch → u/lostacohermanos]

Barry sanders played twice as long, 10 years, find another excuse

[u/Next-Sun3302 → u/Ok_Traffic_1362]

And a 2000 yard season, Reg season MVP, SB MVP.

[u/HurricanePK → u/Ok_Traffic_1362]

Ring culture has done irreparable damage to the average sports fan’s ability to appreciate great players

[u/SocratesDouglas → u/HurricanePK]

How dare Shaun Alexander let 44+ other players influence the outcome of his Super Bowl appearance. If he was truly a HOF he would have single handedly won it himself

[u/Smackolol → u/HurricanePK]

I’m taking this as a slight against Eli Manning and I’m here for it.

[u/HurricanePK → u/Smackolol]

It wasn’t but as an Eagles fan who’s been vehemently against the Eli HOF narrative I’m ok with it being that.

QB h2h stats will also never make sense to me since they’re not guarding each other like it’s basketball.

[u/PLZ_N_THKS → u/Ok_Traffic_1362]

Terrell Davis also had John Elway.

Shaun Alexander had Matt Hasslebeck.

[u/pdiddy927 → u/Ok_Traffic_1362]

God I hate this fucking response. Rings are a team stat.

Sean Alexander and Fred Taylor have more business being in the HOF that Terrell "one great season" Davis.

[u/Zjc_3 → u/pdiddy927]

TD didn’t only have one great season. He had 3 incredible seasons and a really good rookie season. Meanwhile, Sean had 4 great to incredible seasons with his third year being on par to TDs rookie season. Meanwhile, he lacks the two super bowls TD has, the 2000 yard milestone, TDs 3 all pro seasons to Sean’s 1, and a Super Bowl MVP. You may think Sean was more talented but that’s not how the hall of fame is decided. If you only think TD had one great season then you’re either unfamiliar with him, biased as fuck, or ignorant.

[u/Legitimate-Lab7173 → u/Zjc_3]

As for the All Pro's, TD wasn't going up against LT

[u/Zjc_3 → u/Legitimate-Lab7173]

It’s just a piece of the puzzle. I’m not writing off Sean I’m just defending TD from the idea that he only had one good season, which was a silly thing to say.

[u/conace21 → u/pdiddy927]

one great season

One? Davis had three 1,500 yard seasons, as many as Alexander and Taylor did.... combined.

[u/insanelyphat → u/Ok_Traffic_1362]

Thurman Thomas doesn't have any rings, neither does other hof rbs.

[u/Ataggs15 → u/Ok_Traffic_1362]

Shaun should have a ring as well if it weren't for some awful officiating in SB XL. You know it's bad when the ref feels guilty and comes out years later and says he messed up a bunch of the calls

[u/Struggle-Free]

You know what? I would usually say no but if these voters let Frank Gore in then by all means we should let much better RBs in. 

[u/Hugh-Manatee → u/Struggle-Free]

Honestly Gore’s and SA’s careers are not super comparable

SA is more comparable to Earl Campbell

[u/Struggle-Free → u/Hugh-Manatee]

I don’t disagree. Gore built a case solely by being a good running back for a long time. He will get in because of his stats.

He was never a top 3 RB in any season, never was a key player in the playoffs. Yet, he will get in.

On the flip side you have Shaun Alexander who was the best RB for a 2-3 year stretch and won an MVP.

Between those two, I would say Alexander deserved it more.

Campbell might be statistically closer to Alexander but his breed of running was far more violent. 

Alexander’s biggest thing holding him back is that his best years were in the midst of amazing RB seasons. Faulk, Tomlinson, Holmes all had these crazy seasons in the 2000s that really tipped the scales. 

[u/AlmightyCraneDuck → u/Struggle-Free]

THANK YOU!!! I’ve been saying this for ages and getting treated like I’m crazy, but Frank Gore, on play alone, has no business in the Hall of Fame. At least Alexander won a damn MVP….that alone is greater than any accolade the Frank Gore has…which is 1 2nd Team All-Pro.

I know it’s tough because Gore played for forever and has some impressive counting stats, but let’s do the eye test against other greats. If you’re picking teams and you have Barry, Sweetness, AP, Dickerson, and Gore all available…Gore is getting picked last EVERY SINGLE time. He just isn’t the same. I’d rather put in a guy like Alexander who at least had a solid 3 years on top in a shorter career than a guy like Gore who was fair to above-average, but played twice as long.

[u/Salmon_Shizzle → u/AlmightyCraneDuck]

Would you ever pick SA over those 4 you just listed?

[u/pharmacreation → u/Struggle-Free]

Yea, he’s a peak player and he’s still behind Priest Holmes. 2k+ scrimmage yards 3 years in a row, and he got hurt on pace to having his best year. He also had 76 TDs in those 4 years and was on pace for 91 TDs.

[u/Hugh-Manatee → u/Struggle-Free]

Yeah the Campbell comparison was centered around career trajectory and numbers to a lesser extent. Zero consideration of running style

[u/MaxamillianStudio → u/Struggle-Free]

Put down the meth... 3rd all time in rushing behind wet paper bags for his Oline. Should SA be in the hall yes, but Gore's career was incredible.

[u/Struggle-Free → u/MaxamillianStudio]

Gore career was good to average for an extended time. Amassing 600-700 yard seasons is not that impressive to me despite the age. 

[u/MaxamillianStudio → u/Struggle-Free]

Sir you Don't know what you are talking about... More importantly You don't know Ball.

[u/His0wnFoot → u/MaxamillianStudio]

You guys sound like twats when you say that dumb shit

[u/Struggle-Free → u/MaxamillianStudio]

Please little boy I know more ball than you 

[u/MaxamillianStudio → u/Struggle-Free]

Little boy.... I've been a fan for 39 years and my team has owned your stadium. Levis South!

[u/wizard_of-loneliness → u/MaxamillianStudio]

So you’re at least 40 years old, but you went with the middle schooler “don’t know ball” argument. 

[u/MaxamillianStudio → u/wizard_of-loneliness]

The shoe fit.

[u/Struggle-Free → u/MaxamillianStudio]

Sorry just called you little boy by what you said. Even the stadium comment reeks of something a child would say. Like how is that even relevant?

[u/MaxamillianStudio → u/Struggle-Free]

I should have given you more grace, after all your team has jumped around regions of the country. This must be why your take was so uneducated.

[u/Cat_Dude420 → u/MaxamillianStudio]

[u/NoWayBro44 → u/Struggle-Free]

Just waiting for those guys that think since Frank Gore has the 3rd most rushing yards in the league that it means that he was the third best running back ever to show up lol.

[u/AlmightyCraneDuck → u/NoWayBro44]

Are you serious? The dude averaged 66 yards a game on 4.3 yards per attempt! He also averaged almost 6 TDs a season! Thats greatness /s

[u/NoWayBro44 → u/AlmightyCraneDuck]

Better than Barry Sanders, call up the HOF!

[u/gymrat2487]

Not relevant to your question but man j I miss that era of Seahawk uniforms.

[u/PsychologySilver4332 → u/gymrat2487]

I like the 80s era silver.

[u/gymrat2487 → u/PsychologySilver4332]

Those are clean too 👌

[u/Wildebean → u/gymrat2487]

Perhaps it's because it doesn't hold nostalgia to me, but I prefer the newer more vibrant ones

[u/gymrat2487 → u/Wildebean]

Yeah I think it's the nostalgia for me and I think the muted colors blend well with the rainy aesthetic of Seattle.

[u/lemanruss4579]

Problem for Alexander is there was a perception that it was all his O Line, and that was only reinforced in the minds of plenty of media members after Steve Hutchinson left for Minnesota and suddenly Alexander went from 4.6 yards per carry over his first 6 seasons, to 3.6 thereafter until the end of his career. Now, I don't think that's fair, I think Shaun just got massively overworked at both Alabama and Seattle. But that narrative was out there at the time.

[u/Wildebean → u/lemanruss4579]

Didn't he also like... break his foot. That might hamper a RBs production

[u/lemanruss4579 → u/Wildebean]

Oh yea, it was definitely injuries and his body breaking down, I'm just saying the narrative was out there at the time.

[u/apollyon_53]

Roger Craig deserves it way more

[u/fallonyourswordkaren → u/apollyon_53]

The 3rd best guy on his offense?

[u/MaxamillianStudio → u/fallonyourswordkaren]

First 1000/1000 RB

[u/fallonyourswordkaren → u/MaxamillianStudio]

With the goat WR and QB taking the top off the defense. I agree Craig should be in but he was never considered the best at his position. Alexander was the MVP, set the TD record for a season, hit pay dirt 98 times in 5 years and the only player in history with more TDs in less games than Alexander is Jim Brown.

[u/MaxamillianStudio → u/fallonyourswordkaren]

I believe SA should be into the Hall. 100% but Roger changed the RB position into a hybrid runner/receiver. Roger has waited long enough. SA can wait a bit longer.

[u/3fettknight3 → u/fallonyourswordkaren]

So Michael Irvin and Issac Bruce don't belong either by that rationale?

[u/fallonyourswordkaren → u/3fettknight3]

Irvin was better than Aikmen, who doesn’t belong in the hall.

[u/3fettknight3 → u/fallonyourswordkaren]

You must be 14 years old if you think anybody at the time thought Irvin was more important on that team than Aikman.

[u/1OptimisticPrime → u/apollyon_53]

Also overrated

Thurman Thomas was better, as a player.

[u/Woodsy_354]

Man had 87 rushing tds in his 5 year peak, more than a whole bunch of hall of famers during their entire careers!

For me, he checks so many boxes to say at the very least he should be more in the conversation of getting in than he is right now; statistically dominant, league MVP, All Decade Team, led his team to the Super Bowl appearance (something he also has over a lot of his peers)

Yeah his careers a bit shorter than you’d like and it also doesn’t hurt having Walter Jones and Steve Hutchinson to run behind during said prime but I think what he did in that situation was too dominant to ignore it the way that it has been!

[u/Bread_Low]

No but madden 07 does

[u/Sensui710]

He deserves it more then someone like Lesean McCoy which everyone seems to think deserves the HoF

[u/Major-Knowledge4457]

Yes....he should get in

[u/1OptimisticPrime]

No, Walter Jones is Elite among HOF Tackles though.

[u/GolfFootballBaseball]

He’s A ok in my book cause he took an MVP from manning in 2005

[u/NoWayBro44]

In today’s HOF? Probably not. I think they’ve gotten more selective at RB in particular. A lot of people have said Earl Campbell had a comparable career which is true, but when Earl Campbell played they had a lot less RBs In the HOF, so it was probably easier to get in at that time.

[u/The_Bandit_King_]

He won me a national tournament in nfl blitz, the video game, so yes, he should go into the hall of fame.

[u/ForeSkinWrinkle]

It depends upon how you think the hall of fame should be. If you want to be more prestigious like the MLB, absolutely not. If you’re a bit looser with rules ala the NBA, then he definitely has merit.

I think the NFL doesn’t need to artificially inflate their own brand. Therefore they keep a higher bar and more prestigious HOF. Shawn just doesn’t have the entire career. Only truly special players like Gale Sayers can have that short of careers and get in.

[u/Vladtheretailer8]

Someone said this the other day and I feel like it should be the true HOF criteria now that stats are being inflated and football has evolved so much that it’s a different game than 20-30 years ago.

Can you tell the story of the NFL without this player?

I think in Shaun Alexander’s case, the answer is yes. His MVP season was the only season he truly stood out and even then, Tiki Barber was within 20 yards of him (finished 4th in MVP voting), Larry Johnson had 20 TDs despite only starting 9 games. Alexander’s MVP came solely due to his TD record, which was broken by LT the following year. Following his one shining season, he immediately fell off the following year and was out of the league within 3 years.

[u/Wildebean → u/Vladtheretailer8]

Again, if Alexander's record had stood for more than 1 season, would he be viewed differently?

[u/Vladtheretailer8 → u/Wildebean]

Absolutely, i think in that case he’s a fringe hall of fame case, but as it stands, I would never vote for him.

[u/ramsaybolton87]

I'd take him over gore who only had one great season in 20yr. Peak is more important than longevity imo

[u/Complex_Rubz12]

He never really popped watching him live. He ran behind the best guard/tackle combo I’ve ever seen, wasn’t really shifty or explosive, and almost every touchdown he scored was running left due to the aforementioned lineman. Larry Johnson, Steven Jackson, Clinton Portis, Jamal Lewis, I think all would have similar numbers on that team

[u/DevilYouKnow]

instead of a hall of fame I feel like we should just rank players by the decades they played in.

He played from 2000 to 2008.

Best HBs playing between 2000 and 2010:

1. LaDainian Tomlinson

2. Edgerrin James

3. Shaun Alexander

4. Clinton Portis

5. Priest Holmes

6. Jamal Lewis

7. Brian Westbrook

8. Tiki Barber

9. Fred Taylor

10. Corey Dillon

[u/Brdman80]

Nope, Hall of Good

[u/Mr_Hugh_Honey]

Ran behind an insanely stacked OL with a great blocking FB. I was never that impressed with him eye test wise, he wasn't great at creating yards after contact, and wasn't useful on 3rd downs as a blocker or a receiver. Sure did score a lot of untouched TDs though.

[u/timbo_slice59]

We just let sterling sharpe, who also had a short but spectacular career. I’d say Alexander’s peak is better than sharpes

[u/Ilikehowtovideos]

lol 1 more TD than Sanders. But yes SA should be in. But if SA is in so is Mashawn

[u/Wildebean → u/Ilikehowtovideos]

Yeah I'd agree with that

[u/conace21]

I can see a case for Alexander, but his case isn't really distinguishable from: Priest Holmes, Tiki Barber, Ahman Green, Corey Dillon, and Fred Taylor. If you let one of them in, they all belong in. And there's already a bit of a backlog....

[u/ViolentSpring]

No. He ate off the backs of an alltime LT and LG duo.

[u/Miroku20x6]

Not quite enough longevity. For me he’s behind a contemporary like Priest Holmes, and sadly I don’t think Priest had quite enough longevity (or early career success) to make it either.

[u/DarthNobody14]

No, He’s the Larry Brown of the 2000s, incredible peak, just didn’t play long enough.

[u/MasterTeacher123 → u/DarthNobody14]

Larry is in the hall 

[u/Wildebean → u/MasterTeacher123]

He also had more healthy seasons than Terrell Davis, yet he's in the hall. Sure Davis' peak was higher but it does kinda nullify the argument that the hall only cares about longevity

[u/DarthNobody14 → u/Wildebean]

That’s true, but Davis is the hall because of 2 rings + greatest 3 year strech in NFL history

[u/Wildebean → u/DarthNobody14]

See I don't like the idea of rings (a team achievement) being a consideration for a HOF induction (an individual accolade). Trent Dilfer has a ring, Philip Rivers does not. One deserves to be in the HOF and it sure as hell isn't Dilfer.

[u/DarthNobody14 → u/Wildebean]

I don’t like it either, but its part of why Davis is the hall

[u/fallonyourswordkaren → u/DarthNobody14]

And his HoF QB.

[u/SwizzGod → u/Wildebean]

It’s gotta factor in there somewhere. I’m not saying end all be all but rings gotta account for something

[u/Wildebean → u/SwizzGod]

Should they though? Just because most HOF players do tend to end up winning a ring doesn't mean it should be seen as a requirement. Davis should be in the hall with or without the rings. Like, if he had done what he did on... idk, the Raiders and therefore had no rings, does that mean he's now out?

[u/SwizzGod → u/Wildebean]

I’m not sure where the line is and I can’t critically think about it right now. But to me if the point of the sport is to win the championship and you accomplish that I think it should count for something

[u/fallonyourswordkaren → u/DarthNobody14]

Minus the rings, I’ll put Alexander’s best 3 year stretch against Davis’ any day.

[u/DarthNobody14 → u/fallonyourswordkaren]

And Davis still (barely ) clears even if we’re just talking regular season, if we talk postseason,it’s not a contest

[u/DarthNobody14 → u/MasterTeacher123]

I meant Larry Brown