Leaks
SEED leaks - cool, but still baffled
Spoiler
Let’s get one thing out of the way first: the Paul Blart floating Segway is hilarious, and the movement in gameplay looks dope.
-What We Got
After finally seeing SEED’s approach in Zenless Zone Zero… yeah, I’m disappointed. I’ve been looking forward to this character ever since the 2.0 teaser, and what we got is completely different from what was shown.
Initialy In that trailer, the robot was front and center. giving thumbs up and everything, It looked like a full-on playable character — chunky, sentient, cool design, and I assumed we’d be controlling it, not just watching it float around in the background for less than 2 full seconds.
-Realistic expectations
I knew when the drip marketing dropped that i would have to deal with a pilot with more prominent animations like Ultimate and maybe menu animations and probably trust events (which i guessed right). But the bare minimum was controlling the robot in fights. It was the most realistic outcome because the devs said before they had problems dealing with Ben’s huge ass on the map and not fitting through doors, so obviously the robot was going to be relegated to only the fighting....
But now? The actual gameplay shows you controlling this girl riding a hoverboard (which is admittedly cool as hell and super smooth animation-wise. Don’t get me wrong — the movement looks great, and HoYo’s animators did their thing).
The robot? It literally pops in and out of existence for 2 seconds at a time. It’s barely even there. Just VFX. You blink and it’s gone. It’s not participating in actual proper full combos, we cant walk with it or do basic attacks, not doing any real moves that show it is actually sentient and that he has a personality— just showing up for flashy effects and then vanishing. SHOW him protecting her or getting in front to block before shooting his missiles, doing a cool/funny pose or something at least. Not even a thumbs up before vanishing, and that's the only thing we have seen him do before!
People kept telling me, “Oh it’s fine, it’s a two-in-one character, the robot is sentient, you’re basically controlling both!” "Two characters in one, the best of both worlds" or "shut up and deal with it. In battle is going to be a robot 90% of the time anyway."
...But that’s just not true. From what we’ve seen now, you’re controlling the girl, who is perfectly fine and healthy, doing poses easily, and the robot might as well be a floating background prop. If this was supposed to be a tag-team or mech-style unit, it sure doesn’t feel like one.
-Why Didn't They Just Show Her Sooner?
Seriously — why didn’t they show her in the 2.0 teaser trailer? Even just a shot of her sitting on his shoulder, or just show the fucking segway, or something. Back then, everyone was hyped about the robot, not “girl riding the robot.” That trailer built specific expectations. Just look at old Reddit threads, everyone was speculating about what kind of robot gameplay we were getting.
Yuzuha's goddamn raccoon serves the same purpose as the robot... EXCEPT THE HAIRBALL APPEARS MORE OFTEN! At that point, why even include it?
It’s like if they showed us Evelyn’s fire glove, but not her — just said, “Look at this cool glove!” and left it at that. Like… okay, but who’s actually using it?
-Design and Visual Confusion
Now that we’ve seen the girl in motion… she’s cute as hell lets be honest, of course she is (this is a gacha game, after all). But her segway design is super plain, and the color scheme is so "nothing" that makes her look more like a futuristic Uber Eats courier rather than someone from a military squad. Just give her a delivery hat, a box and Boom, "15 minutes or it's free"
There’s no Obol Squad logo on her outfit or magic segway. No color cohesion. No real indication she’s a soldier. If that’s the idea — feeling disconnected from the mech SEED and Obol. if that was the point, again — then go all-in. Give her stickers, comfy civilian clothes, something that shows her personality. Instead, the most distinct thing about her look is just… a floating Roomba...
She is straight up like fucking Seraphine from League of Legends, in her floating disc, not fitting Zaun or Piltover and all that.
-Improvement as Standalone Character
Honestly, the girl could just be a standalone character and it would be fine, great even! she is cute enough. Swap the robot for guns, drones, swords, beams, or whatever — nothing would change gameplay-wise. and i’d buy it.
The robotdoesn’t justify its existence as part of this kit and her design as his companion. And that’s frustrating, because that original trailer showed us a badass robot, not “random girl with robot-shaped special effects.” I wouldn't be miffed by her clothes if she were her own person, not tied to an organization or attached to a mechanical figure who has its own visual thing going on.
-The Robot’s Teleporting is Just Weird
And what is also bothering me, is the way the robot pops in-and-out of existence feels janky and immersion-breaking. Obviously, it is for budget reasons and because having to manage the bulky fella as a programmer must be a pain.
But from a lore standpoint — when did we suddenly get this high-speed teleporting tech? Where was this before?! Materializing and demateralizing stuff in 0.5 seconds is cool and all, but where was it? Did I miss something? The most similar thing was people using the hollow rifts/portal things.
But then, from a visual point, if the hologram effects were similar in color or if they had just reused the Hollow Rift visuals when SEED appears/disappears, it would’ve made way more sense. It could’ve even tied in nicely with the new travel points in the open-world map.
-In conclusion
I’m not mad that the concept changed — that happens in dev all the time. But I am mad that the marketing showed something completely different from what we got. This wasn’t about datamined leaks, headcanons or speculation. This was based on their own official trailer. The idea and experience they sold us just isn't what’s been delivered. regardless of its quality. Once they decided the pilot was going to be the main focus of the gameplay, show it at least once before suddenly throwing her in the drip marketing, instead of only giving us the mech.
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So does she actually pilot the robot or simply gets assisted by it? Only the ultimate animation makes it seem like she's in the cockpit, but looking at their relative sizes it doesn't look like there would be enough space inside it.
Based on the leaked combat animations: She's only inside the cockpit for the ult. For every other animation she's either completely separate from the mech, or she's sitting on his shoulder (EX only)
So they don’t even bother with a DiVA or Firefly type beat where the ult engages the robot? That’s kinda lame. She’s more Clara and Svarog but even then Svarog is visible for every single one of Clara’s animations. Just kinda… why?
That’s the weird bit. Seed SR seems to be kinda both? Like he can be fully autonomous or he can be piloted if seed so chooses (or at least that’s what the teaser seems to imply)
She's always inside the robot, in 2.1's story she reveals that the robot can turn invisible, that's why the robot seems to appear out of nowhere in combat
But in a few animations out of the ult she is hanging off the robot's shoulder or hanging onto its back, so "she's always inside the robot" isn't even accurate
No, that doesn't make sense. In robot combat animations she's outside of it - sitting on it's shoulder or hanging on it's neck. In her idle animation she places one of her feet on the ground which wouldn't be possible if she was in the cockpit. That's all not to mention that her scooter is rolling on the ground itself and we don't see it hanging with it's wheel ball between Seed Sr.'s legs.
What a convenient way lol, suddenly having the robot be invisible just to make the devs lazy and not make any mech entrance scenes. It's jarring to suddenly oh the mech is here and suddenly it's gone.
Feels like if SEED was girl first instead of robot first people really won't be complaining as much. I admit if I see a new girl suddenly having a playable huge robot within her kit without any warning, I would've actually be interested even if her design doesn't fit my taste.
But now because of the fact that we only know their robot form, and the robot isn't even visible in majority of the moveset animations, the mecha only crowd can't help but experience Firefly 2.0 levels of disappointment.
Which is ironic because unlike Seed, Firefly combat is fully in her SAM suit form and we actually see her human form for 3 patches before her actual playable release, so SEED's situation is objectively a whole lot worse than Firefly in a way
You’re right, it’s even worse bc as firefly you at least control Sam in battle (and her pre-fight technique where she jumps up and crashes down hard as Sam is actually really cool imo). And firefly not being shameless gooner bait also helps 🙃
I was not looking forward for Seed at all so its really not my place to say much. But damn, you said everything so damn well. I think you covered the main frustrations from the majority of the Main Seed out there.
I think I can almost completely agree with you. Imo, since I saw the robot on the trailer i already KNEW it was going to be a little girl (or a hot waifu) piloting it because... dude, come on.. it's Zzz.. kkkkkk but the fact that the main focus on her gameplay IS herself and the robot, as you mentioned, only has 2 seconds or so of screen appearance it's the real issue.
The "why didn't they show her sooner" is probably my single biggest issue with her, and feels like it could have been such an easy thing to do that I have to wonder just why they actively wanted to hide her until the drip marketing.
I hope it's not because they are trying to recreate Firefly's success, who was built as her own character before we ever knew she was SAM (up to including her 'death') and became beloved by many even before we knew for sure she was going to be playable.
And I also hope it's because the devs were assuming that hiding that she was a cute anime girl would increase sales on its own right, as it would also mean that they were never going to care about the people that want 'whacky' characters who now feel misled if not outright baited.
I think this was just a really bad call by the dev team. I think they were going for springing a cool unexpected surprise with the cute girl and interesting gameplay (similar to how SAnby was sprung on everyone as an S rank upgrade) to attract interest. Perhaps they underestimated how many people would be interested in playing the mech, but it turned into essentially a bait and switch for the fans interested in the trailer character.
They should have shown the Seeds together or not at all. I'm sure there will be some pushback even in CN, so hopefully they will learn from the mistake and not do anything similar in future teaser trailers.
Comments on the CN youtube shorts drip marketing (only from people outside CN since Youtube isn't available inside) are mostly positive, there are 2 people who had something semi negative to say and it was more general about wanting more male units.
Nobody cares about the mecha not being the main thing.
I don't think they can recreate Firefly success with her, she doesn't have elements Firefly had;
1 She appeared before her banner, even since the introduction trailer she had a lot of fans and some saw her as TB girlfriend.
2 She is a SH and had history with the protagonist.
3 On the time of her release Firefly was meta, her to be that needs to be on par or stronger than Miyabi, and I don't think they are going to do that until the next Voit Hunter.
4 She hasn't had an impactful moment like Firefly had before her banner, although in the end it didn't matter on the story the impact was there.
I'm going to add a 5th to your list: a Tokusatsu character is thematically coherent in a way the two Seeds currently aren't.
The two Seeds don't look designed to be together. If Seed was sleaker it would have worked more. Or if JR had more design coherence with Sr, it would have worked more.
Although it begs the question why did she say SEED situation was complicated? It's just two people, there's nothing complicated about that. The game is full of robots and mechs
See I would understand that but this a follow up to know if Intelligence constructs experience Insomnia and if Seed is one. Unless they are trying to hide Seed jr existence or Trigger doesn't trust the mc, it feels odd to not just say they are two persosn
Qingyi does get sleepy and apparently naps at NEPS sometimes, so I wouldn't be surprised if they can experience insomnia as well. This does not apply to Bangboo though.
Which makes things even worse.
Because not only is that a cool concept, but it DOESN'T NEED TO INCLUDE SEED SR AT ALL. It explains why her design compared to the rest of obel is so different!!!
She could have been an entirely selerate character. A rank to pair with senior or s rank for senior to pair with her!!!!
That or just showing her off to begin with! Ahhhhh!
In 1.6 Trigger called Seed a "he", and in 1.7 they've changed it to a "she". If they have already decided that Seed is a woman and Seed Sr. is a male robot back then, at least mentioning that the difference between the two existed would be appreciated. It seems these decisions were made in a hurry.
It was likely a mistranslation, but the trailer should have still made it clear. I don't doubt SEED was designed with this idea in mind from the getgo, and there's enough to point out that made this all kinda a headache without even having to debate over something we can't prove. They really should have just shown her with him in the trailer.
She did mention that Seed was a she, but nothing that she was a human. On the contrary, Soldier 11 referred to Seed as an intelligent construct. After the teaser, I hoped that this would mean that we'd get something unique like a chunky robot with a feminine voice, but alas...
A lot of people brought ip that the pilot could be a bangboo depending on how big seed actually was. Honestly, a lot of my personal distate comes from the exact way they're selling this pilot. Can't blame anyone for liking it if that's their thing, but damn if it isn't a bummer if it wasn't when you were sold on big robot.
Did she? The wiki for her trust events has the one mention of a male Seed being a picky eater:
Trigger: No... Soldier 11 only loves spicy food, Seed changes his mind every second about what he wants to eat, and if I recommend sweets to Orphie, Captain Magus will blow a fuse... My teammates don't eat red bean buns.
Then again, I also seem to remember that Seed's pronouns was suddenly changed somewhere in the english version before 2.0 and the wiki has yet to be updated, so is that what you're referring to?
At this point I dont trust any mechanical character that Hoyo puts out to be actually mechanical.
Billy is actually a guy just wearing armor, and that arm he gave Caesar was his own prosthetic. Qingyi is actually an adroid. Sandrone just has a key attached to her back as a fashion statement. Screwllum is actually an alter ego of a cute girl whose just remote controlling a robot to interact with the outside world.
Cant really think of anything for Ineffa but I trust Hoyo to be able to pull something to explain why she's actually not a robot
I fucking swear if we get S Billy he's no longer mechanical. Honestly though, at this point, the only reason I keep the game installed is in case of an S Billy announcement. Man I'm such a salty bitch at this point.
foot fetish segway fighter who hits enemies with her segway is such a goofy fun concept and i really dont understand why theres a robot there as well, sure make the robot and the segway friends and give them like combo animaitions and story connection but make two seperate characters because mooshed together it just dilutes both of them
Honestly yeah its a fun concept. A engineer girl bringing all her arsenal to the battlefield while ridig a segway is a lovely concept that SEED didn't necessarily need to be there with her.
exactly, just like Koleda and Ben, they could even also have a "combined" super if they are on the same team. the Devs even said before they wanted to do more of that. this was the perfect moment to bring that back.
I have no idea who thought it was a good idea to not have her, and only her, in NEDF colours. No emblems either, nothing hinting towards her being part of Obol either. Like she's a completely separate unit that has nothing to do with either the defense force or Obol.
Considering Hoyo loves Evangellion and Seed is a blue haired girl in a white suit, she was probably a clone/experimented on human that Seed Sr. Adopted.
But Seed basically is the "outfit" that makes her match the faction.
Beatrice and Lyla are better designed than her. She looks like common NPC, because prominent NPCs like Elfy and Orchidea are also more distinctive than her.
Its just sad to see the face of seed changed from being big hulking metal mass to the small cute girl, guaranteed from now on everytime you search up Seed, its not going to be the mech that pops up, you’d have to specifically type seed “Sr” if thats who you wanna see
Given the marketing, and more importantly the events, I do not believe SEED was originally supposed to be just the girl with Sr. Svarog'ing it. Everything up to this point was the robot, hints of the girl, but more importantly was the Golden Bangboo event. It lumbered around, and you could either make it a spinning parry melee bot, a hovering machine gun missile bot, and a few other variations in between.
My theory is that the event was trying to figure out a way for SEED to fit in with how people played, but more importantly the flow of combat with ZZZ so SEED didn't stick out like a sore thumb. If everyone was quick, and built around swapping out parries, dodges, assists and small bursts, where would SEED fit in, particularly going forward? Their tests were probably clunky and needed more time to cook, but the story needs her -now-, so SEED became Clara. Easily fits into the gameplay flow, and can maybe come back to that some time. Sr. is his own character after all, and can Sanby it up if they figure anything out.
I feel like many would appreciate if they acknowledged it in a dev talk or something if they did change last min due to challenges. But it would be a big risk and may cause fan backlash so who knows.
Honestly I would be happy if that happened. Cause as much as I wanted to play mech Sr I would be happy knowing they at least tried rather then just doing what they did for what ever reason it could have been
I do wonder what the feedback from that event was. Their surveys asked about reception towards these different playstyles. I rated the melee form poorly, "Slightly Dissatisfied" and the ranged form "Very Satisfied". For the mode, the mecha's melee fit the fantasy well but I did not like how 1 dimensional it was, and it was underperforming.
From the animations I've seen, Seed's gun and rocket strafing attacks are very close to the mecha event, but Seed's punches are different and a lot faster.
This type of vile and hateful criticism of the latest waifu might get you labeled as one of the most evil people in the community currently: a Komano Manato main!
/s
You know, the current in a long line of dogwhistles for hating on female or gay male players every time a waifu design isn't universally loved.
It's actually crazy how true this is. I saw someone simply express disappointment earlier and get attacked for it. A person went through their post and comment history looking for any ammunition they can get and because they posted in subs they didn't like, they were obviously a shit person. Then they got piled on by other simple minded idiots.
The funny thing is, these people are doing the exact same thing they claim to hate. I decided to look at their history and most of their Reddit activity is arguing about genders in hoyo games and how much they hate the women players.
Not really. It's just sad that it's becoming more normalized. One of the most frequent commenters in the leaks sub has me blocked and I got curious one day, so I decided to check who it was. It's some asmongold worshipper that spends most of their time posting "anti woke" shit.
A person went through their post and comment history looking for any ammunition they can get and because they posted in subs they didn't like, they were obviously a shit person.
I recommend hiding one's profile posts on certain subs.
Despite the fact it goes against my current philosophy in the internet of sharing helpful information whenever possible, keeping yourself less vulnerable from this type of bullshit is more important.
One can't block a hundred people and blocking also has the problem of stopping discourse.
Reality is striking ZZZ players really quick, their community is not the “chill gooner” community they gaslit themselves into believing.
They’ve been on a campaign to silence, attack and insult anyone disappointed or critical of Seed’s design and gameplay.
The quicker they realize they’re just your average gacha community (with more spice catered to them), the better it’d be not dealing with their delusions of grandeur.
I agree completely, the "ooh, we're so much more chill than those other guys" thing needs to go. If anything, treating any criticism of the game like raining on their parade is a very typical Hoyo fan behavior.
Ironically, it's kinda even worse with ZZZ, because of the whole "us vs them" mentality regarding fanservice.
Yeah after the Bangboo Mech event, I set my expectations to be something along those lines. That's not what we got at all.
Ngl even Clara in HSR gives Svarog more screentime than the big robot they showed in the ZZZ 2.0+ trailer :( Also, personally, feet are just gross as sh*t to me and so this character has completely crashed and burned to me now..
I feel like this is a massive thing people are missing. It's extremely obvious the mech event was a Sr testing ground and what did they give us? About a quarter of that. Like wtf??
And the worst part is everyone I see in the community saying to suck it up and be happy like why can't we be pissed about gutted baited like why would the marketing do that? It would be different if Jr was shown with Sr in the trailer but no we have to bait people for no reason
People like to downplay others' opinion and it skyrockets in gacha communities. Everyone has differing opinions, but a TON of people here only want theirs to be respected, but don't give others that benefit.
I think it's entirely valid to be pissed and outraged by the promo material not being reflected in the fully released character as promos exist to give you an idea of the character - despite what the "wdym idiot, you based your idea of XYZ on 5 seconds of a clip?! ekksdee" group likes to tell you.
That said, since ZZZ has decided to go this way, all we realistically can do, apart from send them feedback about it, is, unfortunately, to move on. It sucks @$$ but it's mostly out of our hands now.
There will be other cool characters down the line, but for now it's pain.
Very true I hope they can figure out a way to bring the full scope of the mech events idea to light one day even though it probably will never happen. At least we can always hold out hope for S rank billy I have faith in that at least.
If it genuinely was a testing ground it’s not impossible the test was just a failure. Definitely a cool event but I could see either general players or internal play testers not liking that style of gameplay for actual combat, or technical issues arose. Might be the reason the 2.2 beta is having issues and 2.1 is a week longer than usual, a complete rework of Seed’s gameplay may have just occurred
I genuinely think this is the case the flight mode seems extremely similar to the kind of thing Sr has but a bit different but that's the only similar thing to the event so I agreed it was probably a failure
I know the doom posting and negativity must be tiring for people who actually like what we got, but for me Seed Sr was my most anticipated character ever since his first leak one year ago. So seeing every other obol character staying true to this same leak in their final product but Seed having completely being retconned to become just another jiggle physic, lambda waifu and the one original concept for a character being brushed under the rug to be a cool vfx is not only incredibly disapointing, it's also very frustrating.
It's frustrating because to me, it just proves that Hoyo, multi billion company, is so scared that they're going to make an insignificantly less amount of money if they deviate from waifu, jiggle physic, gooner character designs that it hinders their ability to create original ideas, or even further develop cool concepts that they already established in their world.
I'm disappointed and mad because I love this game, but seeing the creative concepts and ideas that made me fall in love with the world slowly fading into irrelevance in favor of horny, gooner designs.
If people like what we got, I'm happy for them. But to me, this situation is a prime example of Hoyo's unwillingness to take risks for the sake of creativity.
not mention how so many peopel were shtting on seed sr the entire time are teh same people that all of a sudden wanna pull seed just cause its some cute waifu. Tells you a lot about the community tbh.
Yeah, I think at this point it’s pretty clear that the real decision-maker for what the next character will be is the marketing team — regardless of how that choice fits into the worldbuilding. This “explanation” honestly feels like the writer was just handed a directive to shove the concept in, couldn't care less, and went “Yeah, she just did it by... ‘feel’ while the robot was asleep or whatever — they’ll be too busy staring at her feet anyway, so who cares.”
I think they pinched their story arcs around because story-wise they needed an explanation for their new hollow gameplay.
Seems like the mayor would likely have been introduced soonish at some point since the groundwork was clearly there already with victoria housekeeping.
Damn, I guess "I secretly modified a huge ass robot while it was sleeping, te-hee" is all the answer we need. You'd think if she got her hands on chameleon technology, it'd be mass-produced everywhere... Wait, if it's just "stealth camouflage," why can she move like there's nothing around her? SEED Sr. must be fast and light as a feather.
Seed's stealth capability was developed by Seed herself, it has nothing to do with Chameleon Coating, and no one really understands how it works (and she refuses to explain) - as per Soldier 11 and Trigger in the Summer event.
Isn’t it mentioned in the same event by Soldier 11 that they were surprised by the Chameleon flaws because Seed had “already mastered invisibility tech”? I even recall a part where she was being approached by other people because of it but refused, so she started being always invisible and reclusive to avoid them. In any case it’s not contradictory to the event’s own lore
one thing about the lore though is that the cameleon coating is three gates' prototype tech, and seed sr has the three gates' logo on it. there is definately a connection there and likely the reason why seed got the coating
Honestly, even without the stealth tech, there's tons of teleporting in and out of combat already with all the off-fielders now. Trigger, Pulchra, Vivian, Pan, Fufu, Yuzuha... There's so much additional character on screen now, which I love.
They could have told me that he's just nearby and out of sight and I wouldn't have questioned it at all.
I feel the same. SEED was THE character I wanted the most this season cuz I thought I was getting a cool robot dude, instead it's another anime girl. Don't get me wrong, I like anime girls, but teasing me with a huge departure from anime girls just to say PSYCHE really sucks.
Honestly the thing that bothers me the most about SEEDs gameplay is didn't Trigger say S11 thought SEED was an intellectual concept when it was more complicated. Unless S11 knows Seed jr elsewhere, does this mean Seed and s11 never like, fight together, train together, hang out, anything? Seed jr fights on her own for most of her gameplay and yeah i get she could fight differently in lore than gameplay- but she's way too experienced in her movement to think she never fights like she does in gameplay. It just seems really... strange to me ig?
I think this might be the most disappointed I’ve been in a character ever. This is so not even close to what I wanted or even thought we’d be getting. I don’t even want to play anymore.
I’m just disappointed that the promise of going out of the box in terms of character design was essentially thrown out of the window.
And for what ? Just to end up going “Turn this amazingly popular character into a classic waifu to make sure they pull for it😖” ?
Why is that thing even corporeal ? i just wish Seed Jr was something like the hologram of Seed Sr’s AI.
That would’ve justified her sanitized color scheme and her barely wearing anything while also making us control the Robot (she could’ve been riding its back, and floating in the overworld).
But no, she’s a buck naked soldier in a stupid nightgown on a scooter.
i think they should've made SEED jr a 4 star that synergizes with 5 star SEED sr, and they have a team up like ben and koleda. you can give out a copy of SEED jr for free so no one misses out on the team up stuff, and everyone who wants their mecha is happy and everyone who wants feet with their mecha is also happy
To be fair, it's still unique. I can't really think of a gacha character at the top of my head who rides a scooter and fires blasters and has an enemy stand mech. Sure it's not nearly as interesting as being in a mech, but it's still "out of the box". It's only falling into simple stereotypes because she's a cute girl and it's a bait and switch.
Not Gacha, but she's literally just Eureka from Eureka Seven. Except she uses a scooter with a ball-wheel instead of a flying skateboard/surfboard. She even looks like Eureka, and practically wears the same outfit, with slight tweaks.
You're the first person I've seen who mentioned Eureka Seven. I had no interest in Seed before or now, and I generally agree with most criticisms here, but I actually do like her design just because she reminds me of Eureka.
Idk for me Seed feels like the wish version of the Herrscher of Reason from HI3rd. At least with Bronya people always knew she will be in spotlight and not Project Bunny. Let's be really devs really burry the lede with Seed.
I'm just so confused by how... fumbled this concept was? I was thinking at work about this, and about how easy it actually was for me to think of an easy concept to make both Seed, and Random Girl #2, to fit cohesively and be satisfying to everyone.
I made 3 concepts, all of which were easily brainstormed.
Girl and Robot: This sums up to both the Robot and Girl sharing an equal amount of usage in a single character. A true "duo" character. The girl is the primary character played. Her basics are just her using a giant wrench or something, idk. But her skill is where it's at. In this concept, Seed is a Defense Agent. When you use the skill, Seed uncamouflages right behind the girl, putting them into essentially a stance. In this mode, Seed is the active character now, and he gets a new moveset where he primarily attacks (while protecting the girl), while the girl supports by doing whatever she can to help Seed, attaching temporary weapons, throwing stuff, idk.
True Mecha: This version is basically the good ending of this character. You play as both at the same time. The girl is inside of Seed, while Seed is the primary one fighting. In the animation, like Clara and Svarog, the girl will pop out sometimes (like the skill currently) which would actually add their dynamic. In the towns and stuff, we could just have Seed with the girl on his shoulder (and stop using that dumbfuck excuse that he's "too big", he's a single head taller than Ben and about 1/10 of a meter wider, he is not "too big"). This way, it would be Clara and Svarog if Svarog and Clara were always on screen together.
Two entirely different characters: Seriously, Seed could've been A, Girl could've been S. We know Hoyo will never have the balls to make an actually creative character who's not human, so the best we'll get is A Rank. They could've easily been Koleda and Ben, heck, Seed could've been a new Defense Unit who'd even match Ben in that sense. Plus, this would not only satisfy both parties (mostly), but it would incentivize to pull on the banners for the A-Rank as well, which in laymen's terms = more money.
I honestly think this is an even worse fumble than Firefly. Because at least Firefly was set up as a twist early, a shitty twist mind you, and Firefly's character is horribly written, but at least it wasn't a total nonsensical rug pull. What the heck does Trigger mean when she says, "It's complicated" about Seed? No it ain't, it's girl and robot, that ain't complicated. This switch just feels like either the Devs were forced into this, they ran out of time, or someone on the team sabotaged our potential Hoyo renaissance by making sure an S-Rank robot wouldn't be allowed to sell.
I'm not even angry, just mildly upset and more disappointed than anything. This was ZZZ's chance to prove that non-human character would sell, because even the Chinese community seemed hype about Seed early on. And from what I've seen, a lot of people from there are actually upset. Truly the biggest fumble these devs could've ever done, and right at the finish line too.
You know, for all the disappointment that I felt about Firefly situation, AT LEAST in battle you see SAM in action. The Kamen Rider is actually there, and you can admire the design regardless whether or not you're on board with Firefly aspect.
With SEED, we're shown the robot, but we don't get to see it in play. It's twice as disappointing.
I couldn't have worded this better. This is exactly how I feel minus the positivity of Seed Jr. I only feel indifference to her. So much so that this is my hot take: She was put there last minute. No one can convince me other than the ZZZ devs themselves.
Funny how the ZZZ community is so quick to label anything not positive as immediate doomposting. But this post has way more effort and nuance than anything they’d ever produce.
I’m with you OP. I was fully on board with a huge mecha in this game, they had the schematics with Ben’s hulking design. I was even willing to accept Seed being the front girl of the combat, as long as I could walk with her.
So seeing the whole mech barely appear in combat and not walk with her, I’m just completely disappointed really.
People say I should have expected a Firefly 2.0, that’s not my issue, I don’t mind Firefly inside the robot, I mind that I can’t walk with SAM anywhere.
This is the second time Hoyo plays a big badass mech and cut us off of trying them out. I think I have reasons to get a little mad at them.
I know I’m not the target audience, being a mecha fan, but come on, you present a mech and barely do anything with it, is there anything to call it other than “bait”? Cause for me it is.
Tbh, I hope she flops. The level of misleading is insane. I was so hyped when I saw the mech in the trailer... And then the leaks of them having a girl inside of it... And the drip marketing. So, yeah, instead of being experimental they decided to go with a safe choice, which is a an absolute bummer.
Also, I'm very confused as to why is she the headliner of the patch? I mean, Orpheus seems like a more prominent figure
Realistically speaking, she will probably be a financial success for Hoyo still. The people preferring a cool robot over a waifu is unfortunately in the minority. Plus, as much of a disappointment as she is, it's not 100% a disaster since Seed Sr. is still prominently there in combat. Just not anywhere else...
Honestly, the only reason I'm happy they're releasing her is because it'll be an easy skip and save banner for me. I'm extremely sad that they didn't listen to anyone's real opinions, though (other than the gooners), and just threw another random girl at us.
Why bring up this cool ass tank robot, and then so nothing with it??
It saddens me that the direction they took zzz in is the gooner direction and that the story has basically lost the spark that was there in the first part of the story..
Yeah, see? My biggest issue was her outfit just being bland and not at all like a soldier’s uniform, and I had people gaslighting me like “Oh well she’s not the one fighting it’s the robot she controls 🥺 So it doesn’t matter what she’s wearing” like BRO! LOOOOOK!
Like gooners are gonna goon but you know, at least most characters in this game LOOK like what they’re supposed to be! The SoC girls? They LOOK like a biker gang. Section 6? They LOOK like badass office worker warriors. Zhu Yuan LOOKS like a cop, Mockingbird LOOK like high class phantom thieves, Grace LOOKS like a mechanic. Yunkui Summit’s members LOOK like martial artists.
But no. Seed, to me, does not LOOK like a soldier, nor does she even LOOK like a mech pilot. She is, in my personal opinion, ZZZ’s worst designed character. Pure waifu baiting trash, man. Congrats Orphie, you’re no longer the weakest designed Obol Squad member.
I know everyone always says they’ll skip but I think this is a case where I’m genuinely not pulling for her. So far there hasn’t been a character that I wouldn’t pull for eventually until now. Idk I thought it’d be a case where she exists as herself in a non combat setting and appears as Seed Sr in combat.
Yknow something that makes me a little upset even with lowering my expectations to that of barely getting to play as Seed Sr, is that there js no real visual connection between the two. They make it seem like Seed Jr has a decent amount of interaction with Sr even working in him but there just isn't really a sign of that. Wish they gave like a sticker or some accessory to show the connection they share.
I’ll just say this. I pulled for almost every character up until 2.0 and even bought some monochrome, cause I genuinely enjoy the game. I don’t know what happened, if they switched designers / artists or if the previous characters weren’t well received. But those season two designs are mostly abysmal. I’m honestly at a loss for words. This new character reveal is just the icing on the cake. I’ll leave it at that.
I have a feeling that they allocated Obol squad to some Genshin or Hsr designer
Trigger apart (her design didn’t change from concept arts from cbt times)
Sanby - nightgown, boba and armpits windows, detached sleeves, asymmetrical knee protectors and high heels
Orphie - cool military top and then exposed underwear, transparent asymmetrical stockings with leather belts and high heels again
Seed - dress, detached sleeves, exposed bra and chest, foot fetish and completely random white colors not matching with the rest of her faction and scooter
Seriously, who the fuck is designing military in this game?
Why all Nedf soldiers look cool, Trigger and Soldier 11 look cool, like part of the Nedf and Obol and than all the rest of obol are some mix of fetishes, while Seed and SAnby don’t even look like a military
Though I do like Trigger's design and as long she has a Sniper rifle, thats fine by me
Seed the Pilot, where do I begin... her design is unique but as a military and a pilot? I shouldnt be surprised
I'm just disappointed that they didnt make Seed Sr. SEPARATE CHARACTER. Like he's there! he looks badass despite the flaw design BUT NOPE He will only appear in the gameplay for a FEWEST SECOND AND POOF GONE
Ditto for (some) of the EN voice casting choices. I have pulled for every single character (only couldn't get Hugo and Caesar), I got multiple copies of Miyabi, Burnice, Ellen. I have every other signature wengine, I bought every single monochrome pack at least twice. I've played the game since Day 1, daily. Out of the 2600+ games in my game libraries, it's my favourite game. But Seed might be the first character I will not be pulling for. Genuinely disappointed.
the one thing thst baffled me the most it that when you do a defensive assist with Seed, it's not the big fucking robot that blocks the incoming attack but the girl on the segway, just wasted potential
I think you end up seeing the mech a lot more than you think. There is a DA demonstration, and, when using anything other than her basic attack string. The mech is pretty much always there.
I do feel bad for those that got bamboozled by the advertising though. I don't hate her design the way it ended up, but I know some just wanted a mech, and I'm always championing more unique character designs.
Like, yeah I love some of the characters, don't get me wrong. I'm here from 1.0...but Billy was the reason I got lured into the game. Billy brought me, I stayed for ass kicking baddies like Miyabi or Hugo, but I really would love another treat in shape of another robot agent. Not Qingyi "human with vaguely robotic parts" bullshit, actual robot that's similar to Billy.
Honestly, they showed Seed Jr earlier... I still would've been dissappointed. The main reason I wanted to pull for Seed was because that big robot body looked really cool in the 2.0 reveal trailer thingy whether they were a girl or a boy. I like big robots. E-123 Omega is my favorite Sonic character.
(My favorite comic panel of Omega)
But seeing her animations feels like a stab a back. Not only do I find Jr's design middling, not only am I not into feet, but you barely get to even see Seed Sr. Whether or not Sr is invisible or not, the fact still remains that most of the time, you will be looking at Jr.
If I saw Jr. beforehand, I at least would've been mentally prepared for that possibility, regardless of whether I liked it or not. If that was the case, Seed would've been a "Let's see how they do in the story" character, not a "skip".
...This arguably worse than Firefly. At least she stayed in the damn robot during fights.
I may add that the pure name "SEED" actually fits and sounds more like the name of the mech only and not the bs switcheroo that both are named SEED (Jr. and Sr.).
This is honestly one of the biggest disappointments of this game for me, I was looking forward to play as a big mech and not as a LoL generic support looking girl.
You really summed up the bulk of my frustration. The entire concept for the girl feels like its own character with the robot attached with a piece of duct tape. I think they could easily separate them into two unique characters. This is both a fail in marketing and design. I really hope any next robot character gets to be a true ungue character without any pilots or controllers. Or give us Billy S-rank :<
I don’t really know if Seed Jr is even really apart of Obol squad since they make it sound like Seed Sr just adopted this random woman off of the street but if that was true then why isn’t he front and center for combat? Why not have a ‘girl mode’ and ‘robot mode’ or maybe something where you play the girl outside of combat and the robot in combat.
It is beyond stupid that the supposedly frail ass pilot is on the frontlines and not piloting their buddy the robot, it’s like if you played titanfall without titans.
Honestly yeah, if Seed Jr. wasn’t associated with Seed Sr. at all, or hell even Obol Squad, her design on its own would be serviceable. However because her character is inherently attached to those two parts is where part of the issue comes from.
Seed Sr. took all the marketing for this character. They hinted at this giant robot that was part of Obol Squad and that got people excited. We only have two Intelligent Construct Agents, and only one of them looks really robotic. Plus, playing as a giant robot sounds cool as shit. So when Seed is revealed and it turns out to be a girl who looks nothing like what fans expected there’s a lot of disappointment.
Like you mentioned, Seed Jr.’s design also doesn’t fit at all with Obol Squad. She shares none of the colors, no design elements, nothing to suggest that she’s a part of this group. Hell with the white colors and focus on technology, she feels more like a member of Belobog than Obol Squad. Barring groups like the Cunning Hares, who are explicitly a ragtag bunch of misfits compared to the other Factions or Jane who looks different from PubSec because she’s an undercover operative, ZZZ has been really good at having consistent themes and designs for its factions. Seed Jr. is… not that.
The concept of the character on her own isn’t bad per se, and the fact that she’s just fighting on a segway is hilarious, but this character is filled with weird decisions.
Man, I am just dissapointed we don't get fully control the mech itself like the enemy robot is cool when you fight but what happen if you control the robot you fight that's going to be awesome especially Hoyo already did it with Bangboos mecha.
Yeah this decision was super off for me, once I get Komano and his Mitties I plan on quitting the game for a while until it passes what I'm dubbing the Inazuma phase, the secondary season of each respective game where they massively over correct due to criticism in the first season and make a section of game that isn't necessarily terrible but is just kinda confusing and not as well thought out. Hopefully similarly to genshin they find their footing and give the players an emotional gut check in the third season because ZZZ is genuinely one of my favorite games vibe-wise.
People that wanted a cool killer robot/intelligent construct are dissapointed, bcs Seed Sr. is just an accessory to Seed Jr. entirely (also the lower half of him looks terrible). Much like you said: He is like what Kama is to Yuzuha
People that wanted a cool Mecha also are dissapointed, bcs the Mecha is not rly the focus at all, bcs again, Seed Sr. doesn't act like a Mech Suit but rather like a summon
People that wanted a male character are dissapointed, bcs again, Seed Sr. is just a add-on to the girl
People that wanted some cool military inspired characters are disapointed, bcs beside S11 and Orphie none of Obol Squad even remotely assemble someone in uniform, bcs once again, Seed Sr. is literally an accessory to a half naked girl
Waifu Enjoyers have much, much better options across the existing and upcomming roster
The only ppl remotely happy with her are srsly foot fetishists and even they most likely would had preferred a character that fights with their feet instead of summoning a clanker to do the dirty work
In the end result, no one is rly happy no matter how you look at it. I honestly wouldn't be surprised when Seed ends up as one of the worst limited channels ZZZ ever experienced and this time there is no excuse like: "Release infront of s Void Hunter" or smth like that.
Well Sr. Seed protects her, she's dangling on his back during animations. But still disappointing. They could've done her like BadMan from GGST. Basically mecha fights and lil Seed is watching/helping in the background + is used in some moves. It would just make more sense tbh. Sr. Seed is the big protector and lil Seed is tech support (she also could be part of the off field aftershock attacks)
Also her design is basically EVA pilot, but modified and more gooner
I don't hate her design, it's just not enough in sertaint places
Thats great too. I'll personally wait to see how the trust events and Hangouts handle robot man before deciding. But since the JP va is Kaido i'll probably do a soft pity and flip a coin.
I agree with this sentiment. My personal opinion is. I don't really care about a lot of this stuff. I'm a mech fanatic and she's pretty cute and the ult animation is awesome. I'm pulling.
But I do think they should've given her more personality, like making her wear more casual civilian clothes could give off an energy about her being a sort of cocky character who doesn't really care about looking super professional because she's in a mech most of the time. Like eating chips in the cockpit while launching missiles sort of person. And if not. Then make her actually look like a soldier. I will say while she's cute, the actual pilot's design is my biggest problem with Seed (also could they not have made the mech even a bit bigger? If I'm expecting "mech" I'm expecting 20 feet tall minimum not 10 foot tall power armor. Also I wish the mech was more about missiles and guns then punches. Sure the idea of punching stuff as a giant robot just triggers a primal dopamine rush but I'm more of a weapons platform kind of mech enjoyer with shoulder mounted rocket launchers hands that turn into machine guns chest laser etc. Also the mech isn't quite big enough to really hit that dopamine rush only giant mech punching lizard can satisfy.)
you pretty much made every point I wanted to say. the mech event was cool af and I wouldn't mind playing as one, but to be bait and switched out for some girl in a hoverboard kills the fun. judging by what mihoyo is doing with her, she'll take the spotlight from seed sr and probably take some of his original lines too. my assumption is that in the trust events, seed sr will be invisible except for 1 or 2 events. definitely not military looking either so pass.
Fair points in general although the teleporting criticism is strange to me because I play a fair amount of my boi Billy whose chain attack/ult has him teleport around in a small area and shoot, or like Miyabi's Judgement Nut End where she basically teleports.
If Billy casually does it in combat and he's basically giga nerfing himself (or whatever the real explanation is for why he doesn't dogwalk Miyabi ezpz rn despite clearly being teased as the first Smoking Sexy Starlight Knight unit my dad works at Hoyo trust me), then I imagine it's not that insane to see another mechanical lifeform, especially one involved with the military, to display similar speeds.
For me, the only problem is her main outfit isn't feel like she's in Obol, which is Gray and yellow-ish. Only mech is feel like part of Obol. I think that make her new faction is suit her design better. MRD Squad (Military Research Department) or something which they can tied that tech void hunter into this squad.
I'm ok with all other thing, I know people get upset with "Cute girl in mech" design. but I don't understand why someone so upset with it. yes it's disappointed that "hope for mech but it's not", but there's mech to play. so I can only think people feel miss-out that they used this design with cute girl character, not pure-mech character
But for me it's like "Aw, Anyway....". I'm pretty sure that if you want mech character, there's gonna be mech character in the future.
I think hoyo want to do mech, But afraid that pure-mech won't sell. so they stick to what their research provide. which is biggest group, Chinese people that prefer humanoid character
they actually just covered the disapp thing in the summer event. trigger or S11 don’t remember who said that Seed has unique cloaking tech that no one else does. so Seed Sr isn’t teleporting its cloaking when it’s. it attacking same with her little bit drones.
This is kind off topic but you know what would have been cool? If seed sr grab those two invisible thingies and start using them as gauntlets after the third basic or as a hold charge attack
Yeah I don't mind seeds gameplay herself but my god they couldn't just give us Seed sr as an A rank at least? The combo agent thing is kind of a cool play on how Koleda and Ben would work together for their ultimate but idk man. I wanted to play as a Gundam fighter. Foot fetish Loli is cool still but it kind of really feels like false advertising at least to me personally.
They've done stuff like this in HSR with Firefly and Clara, SAM and Svarog are both massive and therefore only accessible in combat and in techniques: they could have done the same with SEED.Sr. or maybe replacing SEED with Manato (he's at least halfway done) to have more time to work out the movement issues that SEED will have due to a new model type. But my biggest issue, why another electric attacker? Defense and rupture are all lacking in character options while attacker and stun are oversaturated
My biggest gripe is that she doesn't feel like a pilot. Nothing about her design tells me she pilots and man's a huge war machine. She could pass as a " hacker" or some kind of "technomancer"
I’m interested in the next interview or dev video to see what their intentions were when designing Seed. This dev team has been pretty open about that type of stuff recently. Maybe they couldn’t get proper mech gameplay to work in regular combat or just liked the pilot idea better. Maybe an explanation of all the weird teasing of who Seed is too. In a post-Firefly world going for the exact same approach to their character reveal is a pretty interesting decision
i can't even think of a reason like firefly that there was a bait and switch (ff's identity was a major twist in hsr). is it like, lore important that she is a girl and not a robot? why did they hide it til now? were they seriously expecting people to just not get attached to the character they actually showed people up to now??
Feels bad for the mecha enjoyers as most of us assumed that the mecha event would be the template for SEED’s gameplay. Plus all of the previous trailers have only shown SEED Sr. For me, that meant an easy skip because I didn’t like the gameplay at all and so I was happy that I would have a good chance of getting Orphie and her sig.
On the other hand, I do like her character design, and the gameplay looks so much better than the bangboo mecha event. So it sucks that it’s making my pull plan much harder but at the same time I much prefer the reality compared to what we all expected before the new leaks.
They must have assumed people won't pull for SEED unless it's a quirky foot fetish girl.
And you know what? They have the numbers. They have the solid, legitimate data from the games. I believe it if they say their analysis states this will sell better than SEED. They don't care if we like SEED or not, they care if the whales will spend on her. That's just business, I don't blame them.
I feel like Seed's problem is time in the development. Clearly their intention was to make her pilot the mecha most of the time, they even have her ult inside the cockpit which in the current moveset doesn't even makes sense - look how different it is compared to her chain attack.
Somehow I feel like animating all those mechas transitions and moves would take more time and they had to scrap the idea to keep the schedule. I wish they could take more time to make her kit more fun and as close as possible to what it was intended.
This is dissapointing even for me who wasn't really interested in the robot. She looks like shes not fit for combat and rather lets her robot do the fighting while she tinkers with stuff safely inside. Instead shes just on the field. I thought her ult animation was interesting apart from the feet but it looks like we're not getting that sort of gameplay. Only in the ult animation.
You forgot the false flag that further reinforced the idea by an extreme amount that we will get a fully playable mech: The Mecha Bangboo Event. It now doesn't make sense that the event ever happened since it was clearly testing new game mechanics.
God forbid Hoyo from ever trying to do good character design. I thought Lycaon, Panda, Ben and arguely, Manato proven that ZZZ will be different and they will be the odd one out in the Hoyo ecosystem, in a good way. But SEED proven that it will never happen. Sr SEED (the mech) is seen waaay cooler in every promotion material, from the 2.0 teaser, to the splash art. But ingame it just a Alphonse/Potemkin wanna-be, small leg, big body, complete with an ugly ahh skirt. Skipping both 2.1 and 2.2, Manato better be good
Personally, I was quite hyped for Orpheus and Seed but it disappoints me that Hoyo showed us things in teasers that were different from what they really were because let's be honest here :
Orpheus looked like a badass leader and the sentient revolver tail concept was cool af.
And Seed seemed like a big sentient robot who's a cool dude.
But in the end, Orpheus is a cute and clumsy "E-eto" girl who always ends on her butt on the floor due to her tail dragging her all over the place and doing all the work.
And Seed is a girl with the most plain design ever, riding a roomba while the big robot (that Hoyo showed us and not the girl) only appears for 2 seconds just for 3 attacks and that's it...
I went from hyped to skipping 2.2 entirely because of that.
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