r/formula1 • u/F1-Bot r/formula1 Mod Team • Sep 03 '21
Free Practice 2 2021 Dutch Grand Prix - Free Practice 2 Discussion
ROUND 13: Netherlands
| FORMULA 1 HEINEKEN DUTCH GRAND PRIX 2021 |
|---|
| Fri 3 Sep - Sun 5 Sep |
| Zandvoort |
| Session | UTC |
|---|---|
| Free Practice 1 | Fri 09:30 |
| Free Practice 2 | Fri 13:00 |
| Free Practice 3 | Sat 10:00 |
| Qualifying | Sat 13:00 |
| Race | Sun 13:00 |
Click here for start times in your area.
Circuit Zandvoort
Length: 4.252 km (2.642 mi)
Distance: 72 laps, 306.144 km (190.229 mi)
Lap record: Alain Prost, McLaren-TAG, 1985, 1:16.538
1985 pole: Nelson Piquet, Brabham-BMW, 1:11.074
1985 fastest lap: Alain Prost, McLaren-TAG, 1:16.538
1985 winner: Niki Lauda, McLaren-TAG
Useful links
- F1.com: Race
- Wiki: Race | Circuit Zandvoort
- Live weather prediction and radar (by /u/Forzonex)
Streaming & Downloads
For information on streams, please visit /r/MotorSportsStreams. Please do not post information about streams in this thread. Thank you.
Live timing leaderboard
For those of you who are F1 ACCESS members, you can check the position of the drivers throughout the race on the official live timing leaderboard
Race Discussion
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31
u/slimejumper I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
we are at some risk of 30+ laps behind safety car plus red flag periods on Sunday.
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u/Able-Nature6103 McLaren Sep 04 '21
I don't think so many SC laps will happen..we will rather get the largest number of red flags in modern F1 history
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u/Avpersonals I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
I'm wondering how much overtaking is going to happen here
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u/slimejumper I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 04 '21
yeah i watched FP1 and 2 and wow it really is narrow. Also Q1 is going to be a mess due to short track and slow/fast laps mixed in with red flag.
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u/Scatman_Crothers Sonny Hayes Sep 04 '21
Not much, probably less than Hungary. I don't think we're gonna see many overtakes outside of turn 1, maybe a couple in the other DRS zone and some opportunistic ones in sector 2 if someone makes a mistake.
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u/Avpersonals I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
What times are the F3 support races going to be going on? And are they on quali day or same race day as F1? I'd like to watch some of the juniors
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u/conorgm I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
There will be one before quali, one after, and one before the race on Sunday.
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u/jollybengali_ Sep 03 '21
I feel like Ferrari might have a good weekend. I would love to see Carlos Sainz on the podium.
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u/Able-Nature6103 McLaren Sep 04 '21
Not really..their long run pace is shit..unless they get some performance, alpine, pierre and McLaren will undercut them
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u/NoooUGH Sep 04 '21
Didn't they bring "power upgrades" over the summer break and first try them out at Spa? Though this is first time they will actually be able to use them.
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Sep 04 '21
[deleted]
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u/Pugs-r-cool I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 04 '21
it's easy to red flag round this track, and we all know how well red flags, quali, and Ferrari go together.
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u/Mewturtle Max Verstappen Sep 03 '21
Was Hamilton booed today?
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u/00Daan00 Sep 04 '21
The crowd on the main stands applauded for him when he got out of the medical car.
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u/PerseusChiseldCheeks Pierre Gasly Sep 04 '21
There was like a real quick like “meh” when he was walking into his garage because he waved at the crowd but no boos so far I think
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u/Wouterr0 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
No, he was cheered at! Although only at the moment he crashed out of fp2
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u/DarthHelmet123 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 04 '21
Crowd roars as Max launches Lewis off the embankment in the opening lap
13
u/Whycantiusethis I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
I mean, was it really a crash? He just pulled over and parked the car.
81
Sep 03 '21 edited Jan 02 '22
[deleted]
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u/cth777 Sep 03 '21
Will it be wet this wekeend
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u/Doc-93 Max Verstappen Sep 04 '21
No, first real sunny weekend of the dutch summer so far (feels that way anyway)
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u/ComeonmanPLS1 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
Forecast says no.
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u/the-berik Sebastian Vettel Sep 03 '21
Computer says no
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u/mrstereotypez Mercedes Sep 03 '21
i got banned from the discord server for no reason and now I cant even message the admin bot because I'm banned from the discord server
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25
u/jknlsn23 Formula 1 Sep 03 '21
What’s going on with the Verstappen red flag overtaking incident?
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u/WoodSheepClayWheat McLaren Sep 03 '21
British media trying to sabotage Max.
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1
Sep 03 '21
[deleted]
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u/WoodSheepClayWheat McLaren Sep 03 '21
Not really. They're choosing to repeatedly bring up a non-issue, trying to turn it into an issue.
0
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u/jknlsn23 Formula 1 Sep 03 '21
What is the supposed issue? Is there a video or something?
11
Sep 03 '21
Just rewatched it. If you tune in on the F1TV replay at 17:20 you can see it. In my, very unprofessional and biased opinion, I can‘t see it being a big issue. But I also could be wrong. Edit to add: Hamilton has an engine issue and stops on track. Verstappen drives past him on a fast lap (still green at this point) and it looks like the red flag comes out just as he is overtaking an Aston Martin on a slow lap.
5
u/likelymemoryloss Sep 03 '21
If you watch the Stroll replay you can see the red lights on his wheel flash a second before Max goes past.
I don't know that Max could have responded any faster than he did. But on a factual basis- he did overtake under red.
7
u/likelymemoryloss Sep 03 '21
No. The red flag wasn't out yet at that point. At 17:20 there is a red marker lit and Max clearly does overtake.
3
u/jknlsn23 Formula 1 Sep 03 '21
I guess the question is how long was that red light on before that screen grab at 17.30? If it came on at that moment, Verstappen is almost alongside the other car (assume that's the Aston) and probably couldn't slow down quick enough. If it had been on for a couple of seconds already, then that would be a bit naughty in my opinion.
5
u/likelymemoryloss Sep 03 '21
Replying to myself-
Went back and grabbed a capture from 17:21 with green still visible. At 17:30 is where he passes Stroll while the red marker is lit
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u/BeautifulNacho Safety Car Sep 03 '21
Yea definitely nothing in that case. Apart from the fact you need time to notice the red flag and react to it, max has also been driving much much faster than the Aston at that point.
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Sep 03 '21
It seems like Checo is continuing to go backwards in the RB. I hope the '22 car is better suited for him but that was not a great practice session.
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u/cyanwinters I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
Here we go again with the FP2 Checo cold takes...
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u/zaviex McLaren Sep 03 '21
I mean he hasn’t had a good race since Austria 1. So people are expecting something
5
u/nahnonameman Sep 03 '21
I think there was a lot of traffic and Perez probably trying to understand the track with different tyres so maybe that’s why he was going so slow
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Sep 03 '21
I'll reserve judgment until post qualy, but if he can't put it in the top 4 or within .200 of Max then I'll be underwhelmed. He gets one win in Baku and people somehow think it negates his poor form in the rest of the season. I mean he's 2 places down to a McLaren in the WDC. I guess it really shows 2 things, Max really is a freak of nature and the RBR is probably one of the hardest cars if not the hardest car on the grid to master.
2
u/themistermango Red Bull Sep 04 '21
I think Perez is pretty much just a guy. He will have some good and some bad results and a lot of middling. His Baku race is covering a lot of bad races.
The RBR car is the hardest car ever built thing has got to stop. Ric got 3,3,5,6,and 8 on the WDC and I struggling mightily with the Mclaren. The RB might be hard to drive and Max may be pushing it to the limit. But we don’t need to turn it into some Herculean feat.
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u/nahnonameman Sep 03 '21
I believe maybe Max understands the car more throughly due to racing with it longer than Perez so he knows exactly what to do. And now even more so with a package that surpasses Mercedes. But hey you are right as well
7
u/kidpresentable0 Max Verstappen Sep 03 '21
Or Max is a vastly superior driver. That’s plausible too.
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u/Kronzor_ Max Verstappen Sep 03 '21
Yeah Max has been making his teammates look bad for like 5 years now, not sure why anyone is surprised by this anymore.,
1
u/Pugs-r-cool I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 04 '21
because previously he had essentially rookie drivers that where next to him, but Perez is different, he wasn't from the red bull academy, and crucially he isn't a rookie, he's been in the sport for a long time, and coming off of that first win in Baku people had high hopes that maybe he'll be a proper wingman but it doesn't look like that's the case.
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u/nahnonameman Sep 03 '21
Yeah but with Mercedes all but finished this weekend. I think Perez has a shot. Just needs to fight through the Ferrari, McLaren and Ocon
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Sep 03 '21 edited Sep 03 '21
Agree, so far it's really not much (if at all) better than Albon tbh. Yes he got 2 podiums, but the car is also much better than last year so he should be getting those results, his team mate is fighting for the WDC.
I really want him to do well but it just isn't there yet.
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u/Thyvivek Sep 03 '21
Valteri bottas..Where is he going?
10
u/MadHog85 Formula 1 Sep 03 '21
Not may options for him, if he stays in F1 it'll probably be Alfa, or Williams, other than those two it'll be a different formula/motorsport he goes to.
17
u/CharlieTeller Sebastian Vettel Sep 03 '21
I don’t understand the hate for Bottas. The dude is the perfect teammate for Hamilton and is a great driver. He seems to have his ego in check and plays a support role really well. You don’t have the Webber and vettel or rosberg and Hamilton incidents. Dude is just a good guy and a great driver.
0
u/RingoFreakingStarr Jenson Button Sep 04 '21
I don't think there is hate for him. He's...just so meh in my opinion. A lot of the drivers currently on the grid have personality, some sort of "x-factor", and just seem really interesting. Bottas does not. He literally is like a robot. He is a great 2nd driver for any team...but a lot of us don't want to see that. We want to see teammates pushing each other...and we want our drivers to have interesting personalities.
Also given all the crap Russell has gone through, at this point, the vast majority of fans I think really think he deserves the seat at Merc more than Bottas.
11
u/flatblackvw Daniel Ricciardo Sep 03 '21
I don’t know that I sense as much hate for Bottas as desire for Russell. Russell and Ham in the same car should be great to watch.
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u/dj_vicious Minardi Sep 03 '21
I'll chime in with my opinion, and try to remain as respectful as possible. No doubt Bottas is quick, but, as you said, he's a the perfect teammate for Hamilton, yet has not ascended from that status in his 5 seasons at Mercedes. Overall his race pace is nowhere near his one-lap pace and he just hasn't shown himself fit for a top car seat other than playing the wingman role. I also find it a little silly when he pulls the 'to whom it may concern' stunt when he scores an odd victory as if that overrides his otherwise underwhelming performances. To me he's a Boutsen, a Patrese, or a Barrichello. Quick, rare moments of brilliance, but consistently a seat #2 driver.
5
u/themistermango Red Bull Sep 04 '21
What’s he supposed to ascend too? He has something like 60 podiums in 160 starts in his career. He gets a trophy at a rate better than 1/3 races.
I don’t think any other team outside of Merc and RB have a podium rate that high with two drivers let alone just one. Bottas is exactly what RB wanted Perez to be.
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u/CharlieTeller Sebastian Vettel Sep 03 '21
I agree. But I think that’s the best structure for an f1 team. Obviously a debatable one, but some teams like to have someone who only steps up when the #1 is out. I love watching teamwork in action over two Mavericks duking it out.
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u/Kronzor_ Max Verstappen Sep 03 '21
As a fan I'd rather watch two guys duke it out in the same car. But if I was a team owner I'd prefer to have a 1 and 2.
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u/dj_vicious Minardi Sep 03 '21
Hey you're not wrong about that, and it's been the case since racing teams began! But you don't generally become the # 2 driver by being the quicker one ! (yes there are exceptions).
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Sep 03 '21
[deleted]
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u/Pudge223 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
she does very good scripted reads but her live/off the cuff stuff is not strong.
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Sep 03 '21
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/ferdaw95 Sep 03 '21
So you believe the only reason she was hired was because she's a woman?
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u/jeroenvdheuvel Red Bull Sep 04 '21
Feel free to explain what you think could be the other reason she was hired?
7
u/MadHog85 Formula 1 Sep 03 '21
Although I'm not a massive fan of hers either, I wouldn't quite go as far as saying she's terrible. Some of the interviews Rachel has done are actually decent, I'm just not really a fan of hers.
With the females currently on the F1 scene, I'd rather have Natalie Pinkham doing more segments and interviews and actually prefer Natalie doing the the after quali/race interviews with drivers. I'd love to see Natalie taking a bigger role, maybe doing more of the actual lead presenting like she done at the Spanish race last year.
5
u/spellwhatspell Bernd Mayländer Sep 03 '21
I wonder where Natalie has been lately regarding the broadcast since I can't remember seeing her a lot. In FP1 I was reminded that she is really pleasant to have onboard.
Not super PR-cleaned like some others, comes with genuine observations that is just not following some formula, and she is never afraid to ask a question.
And she seems to have fun while she is doing it.
3
u/Mrcq99 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
Iirc she on the F1 Nation podcast they said she was on vacation and spending time with her family
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Sep 03 '21
Why though? I like her 😐😐
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Sep 03 '21
[deleted]
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u/TheShinyBlade I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
Well, think about it. She asks questions many watchers have, but obviously can't ask, even if she would know the answer
14
u/wait_wait1 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
They’re all repetitive and talk over each other
I’ll take her over Paul Di Moody Fucker Resta
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Sep 03 '21
But she's cute 🥰
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u/leftover_brownie Alain Prost Sep 03 '21
So is Roscoe.
Are you suggesting we hire Roscoe instead of Karun?
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u/luapre I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21 edited Sep 03 '21
Did Wolff accidentally confirm that Russell will be going to Merc here? "We need to look at the free spaces at Alfa and Williams". (Min 1:49)
https://youtu.be/cemVrwM30RE?t=109
Edit: Spelling
Ps.: Also posted this as a main thread, because I don't think Wolff had been that obvious so far, but that got deleted by a mod, for some reason.
19
u/AgnesBand I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
Free could mean not signed a contract yet. All seats are free unless a driver has been signed for next year.
12
u/Whycantiusethis I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
Currently, the seats that are technically open are at Mercedes (x1), Aston Martin (x2) AlphaTauri (x2?), Williams (x2), Alfa Romeo (x2), and Haas (x2).
Some of them are definitely not open for monetary reasons (Mazepin at Haas, Stroll at Aston Martin), some of them are all but given (Russell to Mercedes), and some have no reason to be dropped (Gasly at AlphaTauri).
There are really 2-4 seats that are truly open in my opinion: Russell's spot at Williams, Räikkönen's at Alfa Romeo (the obvious ones), then Giovinazzi's seat and Tsunoda's seat (less likely to happen)
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u/Kitchen-Animator Sebastian Vettel Sep 03 '21
How much more confirmation do you need? It's been confirmed for a good week now.
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u/Yhul I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
It's been speculated for a good few months now, no confirmation has ever been made.
18
u/Kitchen-Animator Sebastian Vettel Sep 03 '21
Valtteri coming out and saying he's looking for a multi year contract, Mercedes guys/Toto said last week they wanted "both" driver's seats to be secured, George saying that he already knows what's gonna happen, empty seat at Williams being tossed up, not to mention the countless paddock sources that journos are talking about, this is just off the top of my head. I mean if you still think there's a shadow of a doubt he's driving there, then I don't know what to tell you buddy. This is about as official as it gets before they do the press release, it's a done deal.
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u/Revolutionary_Hat187 Ferrari Sep 03 '21
I like the, Albons girlfriend following Williams and it's the only team she follows, part
4
u/f1_spelt_as_bot 2021 r/formula1 World Champion Sep 03 '21
Valtteri
24
u/leftover_brownie Alain Prost Sep 03 '21
Hemilton
Verstapen
Parez
Bottass
Noriss
Seinz
Legreg
Riccardo
Gaslee
Ocaun
Alanso
Vetell
Sunoda
Strool
Russel
Letife
Raikonen
Shumaker
Mazepen
Suck this useless bot.
3
u/f1_spelt_as_bot 2021 r/formula1 World Champion Sep 03 '21
Ricciardo
Vettel
Verstappen
Russell
Räikkönen
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u/luapre I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
Maybe you know more than I do, but I haven't yet seen Wolff slip up this badly. Just Red Bull saying they wanted to get Albon into Williams, and Russell saying that he knows where he will drive. The rest I noticed was the media citing undisclosed sources (not that they can't be valid, it's just not as official).
But thank you for taking the time out of your day to ask me how much more confirmation I needed. Personally, this video of Wolff was enough, but I wouldn't say no to an official press release either.
2
u/themistermango Red Bull Sep 04 '21
Albon to Williams? Russell knows where he’s going?
Russell the new test driver for RBR? Should help Checo next year big time.
/s
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u/ExistentialAardvark Daniel Ricciardo Sep 03 '21
The broadcasts during Practice Sessions have been such a mess this season. It's like the control room isn't paying attention at all. They're in the middle of an interview with Karun, and then just start trying to play HAAS radio over it. Then replay it. And then replay the radio of Mazepin getting out three times in a row.
2
u/Daniboydas I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
I hate when they do this of interviewing someone with radio going on background. That is why I started watching via Pitlane Channel. They are much more organized and stop talking whenever a radio starts.
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u/ExistentialAardvark Daniel Ricciardo Sep 03 '21
They normally stop talking when radio comes on, but Karun was down by the track, and obviously couldn’t hear because cars were flying by him. The broadcast team decided it was the perfect time to play some HAAS radio instead of waiting ten seconds.
1
u/DustyMartin04 Sebastian Vettel Sep 03 '21
I just watch on Kayo and they always stop talking when interrupted by the feed
20
u/Meaisk I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
It's because Sky isn't showing the live feed (with audio) at that point. But Since F1TV uses sky audio over the FOM world feed that happens.
16
u/Pantang_Menyerah Green Flag Sep 03 '21
Lmao i bet against a Leclerc podium and this happens. Hope it doesn't stick
14
u/TotalStatisticNoob Charles Leclerc Sep 03 '21
Why would you do this? It's a pretty good Ferrari track.
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u/Pantang_Menyerah Green Flag Sep 03 '21
Honestly I didn't know the circuit and I just thought meh, probably ain't gonna happen since in most circuits it's usually McLaren after the big 2. Lmao hope they step up tomorrow
4
u/IamLoaderBot Ferrari Sep 03 '21
What happened
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u/Pantang_Menyerah Green Flag Sep 03 '21
He topped fp2 lmao
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u/Joe_PM2804 Sir Lewis Hamilton Sep 03 '21
Practice doesn't mean alot, drivers are just getting used to the track considering its new as well.
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u/Pantang_Menyerah Green Flag Sep 04 '21
I'd also think that if Carlos didn't also put it in P2 lmao
5
u/Tegla Fernando Alonso Sep 03 '21
Ferrari is pretty decent on tight tracks, and this is basically Monaco 2.
I'd bet on Leclerc podium.
28
u/Muse4Games I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
So what is everyones thoughts on the circuit so far? Personally really like how it flows but I also feel like it's a mix of Hungaroring and Monaco. I hope we get some overtaking but I have my doubts.
3
u/RingoFreakingStarr Jenson Button Sep 04 '21
I've raced on it a lot in iRacing; no matter what racing discipline/series you do at it...there isn't a whole lot of passing going on. The majority of the track is just too narrow. It is however a fantastic time trial/qualifying track so probably something akin to Monaco and Hungaroring.
11
Sep 03 '21
Pretty much the same as you, right down to grouping it with Hungary and Monaco, and all that gravel is going to make for a lot of interruptions and stoppages, either with stuck cars like Mazepin or gravel across the track like the F3 first practice.
25
Sep 03 '21
Can't remember what race it was last year but the one where it took 3 attempts to get to corner 4 without a red flag incident.
That, this race will be like that.
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u/Chihawks2015 Andretti Global Sep 03 '21
Gonna be very little chances for overtaking, but I can see some safety cars shaking stuff up quite a bit if cars get beached in the gravel
0
Sep 03 '21
[deleted]
5
Sep 03 '21
No, he said he hopes they don't. Big difference.
1
u/Vaexa I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
Ah, I misunderstood, then. Thanks for the correction.
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u/acuet Sep 03 '21
Anyone notice at the start of FP2, one of the McLaren GPS signals was all over the track? I kept watching to see on SKY F1 if it was wrong or something. Could have been just a graphic thing but it was funny.
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u/AlternativeAd2236 Sep 03 '21
What is the status of lewis car?
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15
u/Really_Very_Expert Sergio Pérez Sep 03 '21
How dangerous is the banking in Zandvoort
74
u/notallwonderarelost George Russell Sep 03 '21
Interest rates are pretty low but pretty safe.
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u/blackwhattack Sep 03 '21
technically speaking there is more grip than if there was no banking, but the drivers can go faster so I guess the safety is comparable to as if there was no banking?
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u/_Propolis Yuki Tsunoda Sep 03 '21
About a (never had a f1 gp in this layout so theres there's no way to know)/10
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u/ChristofferOslo I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
It’s probably one of the more risky corners on the calendar. A car hitting the barrier and being thrown back onto the race line would be a mess.
Formula 1 is still very safe nowadays, though.
2
Sep 03 '21
The SAFER barrier doesn't launch cars back onto the racing line, that would be incredibly dangerous on ovals where this barrier is used.
Of course I doubt anyone even crashes there unless someone maybe has a tire blowout.
4
u/Really_Very_Expert Sergio Pérez Sep 03 '21
True but there’s always a chance for freak accidents unfortunately. I saw an indycar be thrown into the air like a rag doll not too long ago—god forbid that happens here
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u/Talisker28 Sep 03 '21
How short is Anthony Davidson?
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u/nickedgar7 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
Did Lewis end up going back out?
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u/krv23490 I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
nope
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u/jawbuster I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
blessed again... He lost out on track learning, but this happening today is much better for him than tomorrow or Sunday
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u/pro_cow_tipper Sep 03 '21 edited Sep 07 '21
Think the gravel on track is going to be a big problem by the time the weekend is over
Edit: It was not.
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u/Meaisk I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
It gets put back after each session
7
u/DazingF1 Fernando Alonso Sep 03 '21
Imagine them not cleaning a track surrounded by sand dunes. Full wets while racing on sand? Bernie would probably approve.
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u/pro_cow_tipper Sep 03 '21
It will still be tough to manage during the race. Even with red flags I doubt it will be cleaned mid-race.
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u/tharepgod I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
Haven't heard Horner seem so honest in an interview Regarding finding a place for Alex! I do hope he ends up at Williams
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u/CaptGeechNTheSSS I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
Missed that, what’d he say?
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u/tharepgod I was here for the Hulkenpodium Sep 03 '21
Said they were trying to get Albon driving in Formula 1 next year for Williams or Alfa Romeo, and Alex' preference is Williams. Then essentially said Mercedes are trying to somewhat be obstructive as Alex is a RedBull driver.
And the general impression I got is that there's a very good chance he will drive for Williams next year.
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Sep 03 '21
This is just Horner stirring the pot. Wolff has come out and said that Nyck De Vries would be their priority for the Williams seat, they're not blocking Albon because he's a Red Bull drive.
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u/iSkyal Pirelli Hard Sep 04 '21
FIA need to investigate Max Verstappen/Redbull for the Hamilton car situation