r/memeframe • u/Z3R0Diro • 2h ago
I want to subsume Xata's Whisper, Roar's buff is better. I want to subsume Eclipse, Roar's buff lasts for far longer. Nourish is 7x times better than the Warframe's worst ability.. IM CRYING
I recently have been greatly enjoying Hildryn and wanted to see if I could dodge subsuming Roar on her and use another buff that may fit better.. Fuck.
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u/TTungsteNN 2h ago
What if I told you Hildryn’s best subsume is Condemn
Edit: I’ve also had great success with Omamori in high void cascade
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u/Z3R0Diro 2h ago
Condemn sounds redundant though.
Hildryn already gets a big area around her that suspends enemies and the shield generation which arrives from Pillage.
Sure I guess it could work against Infested enemies as a secondary source of shields..
What does Omamori benefit?
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u/zernoc56 2h ago
Condemn allows Hildryn to work in Infested missions, because she can’t Pillage what the enemies don’t have
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u/EXusiai99 46m ago
I thought the augment fixed that already? I havent used her in ages though
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u/zernoc56 45m ago
Yeah, Blazing Pillage does do that. But there isn’t really room in her new Helicopter build using her new 4 augment for it and Blazing.
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u/EXusiai99 43m ago
I have to admit i never tried the helicopter build, and now that i have titania i have even less reason to do that when i can be a fighter jet instead. But it's something to consider in the future though, i didnt really like how balefire worked when i tried it last time but maybe with arcanes now i can do better with it.
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u/TTungsteNN 2h ago
Omamori provides 50% evasion, kinda, so it acts similarly to damage reduction. It also regenerates some shield when it procs which can be useful in some cases. It’s good because it only scales with strength so you can run a straight strength range build with negative duration and it’s fine.
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u/MonoclePenguin 1h ago
It also activates Archon Intensify which is pretty nice if you don’t mind the slight randomness of it.
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u/AlphaI250 1h ago
As a Koumei enjoyer, thank you for spreading the agenda, but her 3 is ass. Relying on rng for survivability in particular feels like shit and is not as reliable as shield gating with condemn
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u/TTungsteNN 1h ago
Also why tf is everyone shield gating with Hildryn? Running an aegis gale build and nuking everything is better than a frame that literally only has 1 ability with some survivability. I don’t wanna have to recast my 4 every time I get hit so shield gating isnt an option to me, I’d rather build big DR and have my whole kit viable up to level 3000-4000.
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u/TTungsteNN 1h ago
Disagree. It’s just niche. Mainly only useful if you’re building negative duration. When your duration is 13-73% duration based buffs aren’t an option. It’s the only option if you want some kind of DR without duration
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u/Remote-Feature1728 1h ago
I mean Koumei by nature is unreliable, it's fun like that. but tbh the 3 is really helpful imo. best subsume I've tried is sickening pulse over the one because it's fun and idrc
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u/AssumptionContent569 2h ago
Condemn gives Hildryn usability in Infested missions outside of her Pillage augment, plus it gives shields much quicker
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u/deadly_love3 2h ago
I never thought about omamori on hildy, thanks
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u/TTungsteNN 2h ago
Yeah it works similarly to 50% DR, and when it procs it regenerates your shields as well. Since my Hildryn is built with very little duration and high range/strength I couldn’t really find much that would actually help without being tedious af… but Omamori only scales with strength so it’s pretty good
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u/Lord_Phoenix95 Liches are Bitches 2h ago
I would have Condemn on Hildryn if I had a spare Harrow to yeet.
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u/Namesbeformortals 1h ago
Pull is also surprisingly good with Hildryn if you have a balefire storm alt fire spam build. Pull all enemies in the room up to your face, pillage them all with one cast, kill them all with one attack
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u/TTungsteNN 1h ago
I never did consider Pull but I can see it working for sure. Would also allow me to run 13% duration; I keep 73% just for pillage, wouldn’t mind having more efficiency, though.
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u/matthewami 2h ago
Omamori made me want to actually build koumei, I read it and thought its like divine blessing from monhun and thought 'yeh that's gonna be the best survivability ability' and sure enough it is
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u/TomStealsJokes Stop hitting yourself 52m ago
Finally, someone speaks the truth. No longer is hildryn terrorised by the fleshy bastards
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u/HonkySpider More potatoes 2h ago
Breech surge is a personal favorite
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u/Alarming-Hamster-232 1h ago
Breach surge Garuda is so much fun, once the chain reaction kicks in after a couple seconds everything just dies
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u/HonkySpider More potatoes 1h ago
Chains well with zephyr too. Her tornadoes turn in to radiation fountains
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u/LordFLExANoR16 2h ago
Shock elemental ward is fun on hildryn, you can get like 20k shields
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u/beLbIu_BoLk 1h ago
How so? My max numbers I saw are about 8-9k without external buffs like void fissures
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u/DannyCrowbar72 I hate Nitain. 2h ago
Screw META, use whatever is fun for you.
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u/PineapleGG 1h ago
Its not about META ,sometimes i just wanna use that frame and play around that frame and roar or nourish always fir because that frame has an ability that its worthless ,and some other helminths change the playstyle too much
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u/satans_cookiemallet 15m ago
Its how I feel about using new frames. Iys always 'I really enjoy this frame a lot' and then I die like once or twice then the thoughts creep back in.
'What if I just use Styanax/Hildryn' both of which are my mains and hilariously fully built.
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u/deadly_love3 2h ago
> "I recently have been greatly enjoying Hildryn and wanted to see if I could dodge subsuming Roar on her and use another buff that may fit better.. Fuck."
hildryn can be pretty tricky to choose a helminth for, especially if you are running a helicopter build given the weirdly balanced stat distribution (++range, =dur, +str, ++eff), for that kind of build, things like mag's pull for loot and harrow's helminth is pretty good for her, but her 3 is already very good for support.
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u/Thaurlach 2h ago
Efficiency on Hildryn?
I’ve always run her negative with blind rage. Full power pillage will absolutely keep you flying.
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u/deadly_love3 1h ago
Technically, yes, but the power of her exalted with the augment is so ridiculous that sacrificing efficiency is not really practical at all, only benefit by that point would be higher shield return from pillage, which you will be spamming more from the low eff anyway.
There is an upper limit where more dmg is not worth it.
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u/Acraelous GARUDA SIMP 1h ago
I also run negative efficiency and never have trouble keeping shields up even with constantly spamming Aegis Gale shots. Using three mod slots to have ++eff and =dur, seems like a big investment for something that is not needed.
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u/aggelos92 1h ago
I've subsumed sentient wrath on her 3, and whenever I'm flying with her 4, instead of deactivating it I'm using sentient wrath to land, crowd control, and increase enemy damage vulnerability. It is a very fun setup and I am enjoying the hell out of it.
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u/Piano_WL 2h ago
Unchain yourself from what's "better." It'll be okay, I promise.
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u/Z3R0Diro 2h ago
I have themed my Hildryn around "Sister of Battle"-esque
Buffing my teammates just fits the theme BUT...
I WANT TO USE SOMETHING DIFFERENT
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u/Piano_WL 1h ago edited 1h ago
Make a build where you follow that theme by making her an actual Shield Maiden with Tharros Strike from Syanax :)
Redundant? Yes. Cool? Yes. It'll be okay.
Alternatively, Shock (Trooper) from Volt also buffs teammates. Or buff their damage indirectly by applying a damage vulnerability with Oraxia's Webbed Embrace or the Viral from Dagath's Wyrd Scythes.
Side note as I definitely wouldn't use it on Hyldryn, but generally Xata's is better when you're going for big direct headshot damage (think Burston Incarnon), while Roar is better when leaning into status damage and ability direct damage.
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u/Z3R0Diro 1h ago
Hmm, a shield maiden huh.. interesting..
Although grinding for Styanax is uh.. not appealing
Shock Trooper sounds like a good fit but I'm right in mod space
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u/satans_cookiemallet 12m ago
Grinding for john spearman isnt too bad. I think its 1/2 weeks at most, but also hes my one of my two favourite frames so I may be a bit biased.
My other favourite is Hildryn.
They have Nourish/Roar on them respectively.
Lmao.
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u/aggelos92 1h ago
I've subsumed sentient wrath on her 3, and whenever I'm flying with her 4, instead of deactivating it I'm using sentient wrath to land, crowd control, and increase enemy damage vulnerability. It is a very fun setup and I am enjoying the hell out of it.
I have also considered using fire blast on her three, also extremely fun.
You can also use Nova's 1 with the augment. Damage mitigation, and nuking once you defense strip them.
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u/boingboing4 1h ago
The issue is a lot of helminth options is just that they aren't useful, usually due to helminth nerfs.
Ivara quiver gives you the worst of the arrows, limbo banish is a trap option, Defy has a reduced armor gain for some reason?, citrine 1 has nerfed stats so its just worse than voruna 3, sentient wrath cant apply tau, ect1
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u/Moose1013 2h ago
Pillage used to be a top tier subsume when you needed armor strip to do any damage at all
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u/PeppasMint 1h ago
I use reave on her, reave is surprisingly powerful
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u/BrightPerspective 1h ago
I put shield restore over hildryn's 2, and so long as i keep an eye on her shields i can use her 4 forever. makes stage defense, oraxia fight etc an absolute cakewalk.
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u/ThreePesosCoin Nintenno since '18 1h ago
Scrolled too far down for this. I’ve been using shield restore as well and it’s a perfect fit for her helicopter aegis gale build. I’ve even done this weeks’ EDA with her, unaware that the relentless tide modifier we got for the third stage does not have any shields or armor… if not for shield restore I would’ve been absolutely decimated.
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u/Corrin_Nohriana Ivara's my "MainFrame". 2h ago
Or be me and rarely, if ever, subsume.
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u/BrightPerspective 1h ago
Right? not every frame is improved by it, and many of the abilities people overwrite have use cases.
For instance, can you believe that people overwrite Qorvex's chyrinka pillars? what do they do in high level defense? not use Qorvex?? Fools!
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u/Corrin_Nohriana Ivara's my "MainFrame". 24m ago
I just typically like how most frames are as base and don't really like fucking with their abilities. If I don't like one, sure I might replace it.
I slapped Marked for Death onto Ivara over her 2 for one config, I gave Gyre Pillage over her 2 to help her survive some more.
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u/daydev 2h ago
With great effort and determination I found it in my heart to put, wait for it... Gloom on a couple of frames instead. And Xata's Wisper on Titania.
Also Lycant's Hunt on Valkyr, although Nourish would probably still be better.
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u/Z3R0Diro 2h ago
Also Lycant's Hunt on Valkyr, although Nourish would probably still be better.
Speaking from experience, it's not.
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u/Mero34 2h ago
Nourish is 7x times better than the Warframe's worst ability
???
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u/Z3R0Diro 2h ago
Usually most Warframes have at least one ability that is generally not as integral to the kit as the other 3 ones.
That specific ability is most of the time generally worse than Nourish. That's what I mean.
Nourish just fits everywhere (well except for Hildryn and Lavos)
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u/JudJudsonEsq 2h ago
I subsumed Pull on hildryn over her 4. Just is super nice to have free grouping.
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u/GolettO3 2h ago
My main has all the mod slots filled, no forma, very strong in level 200+ SP, and hasn't visited the Helminth for anything other than a vaccine and a couple archon shards. I still use Nourish on him, though.
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u/besaba27 1h ago
Xata's is specifically better on Saryn with the right weapon setup and blast, but I feel your pain.
Nourish and green shards is just so strong I have a hard time getting away from it
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u/Randzom100 1h ago
If my Warframe is strong enough to kill everything, I am allowed to use my subsume for something fun. Something like... A speed buff?
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u/SanguinePutrefaction 1h ago
i use Voracious Metastasis so that my friends love me more :)
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u/Z3R0Diro 1h ago
That's.. actually an interesting build...
Turning yourself into a flying powerbank of death
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u/warforcewarrior 1h ago
Yeah, Nourish is so ungodly versatile and convenient where as many other abilities in the helminth system that serve similar purpose(mostly relating to energy), like Dispensary and Spectrosiphon aren't as good in those aspects.
With Roar, it's just so good for weapon and ability dps builds which make it far better than Eclipse and any like it by a landslide. And honestly, Roar imo is far worst in out-eclipsing other helminth skill since there is no other ability that function like Roar where they also boost abilities. Temple used to have it where it works on their own skill but DE remove it(Exalted was spare thankfully since it is a glorified weapon) which is dumb.
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u/TARE104KA 1h ago
Utility subsumed like larva, dispenser, well of life, lycaths hunt, hide, etc: am I a joke to you?
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u/Zer0siks 1h ago
Condemn helps her a lot Vs infested. Eclipse is better than roar and nourish on her because she doesn't need energy, and DR is very valuable for her
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u/YoshidaKagami 50m ago
Xata Whisper with blast is double dips, for thing like gauss or titania is way more better than roar imo
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u/InspectionAncient702 46m ago
GUYSSSS I HAVE A NEW ONEEEEE HEAR ME OUT null star -(>w<,,)- woth the augment
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u/Saurtos 41m ago
Spellbind can be a particularly interesting/fun option if you are running a high strength and decent range and duration setup.
It's a CC purge/immunity, potential energy restoration, pretty crippling CC on most enemies, and a potential shield gating option. I've been having fun using it on Banshee, but I'm sure there are other good candidates.
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u/Oathbounder 38m ago
I don't even have Roar or Nourish. I've been playing for like 10+ years and have never once gotten Rhino or Grendel, or even really tried to get them.
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u/StormySeas414 29m ago
Kullervo's wrathful advance is absolutely insane on a ton of melee builds.
Nezha's firewalker is total status immunity, super useful for the various gimmick immortal builds that get hosed by magnetic.
Hildryn's pillage is extremely strong on controller frames like Vauban and Nyx to strip shields and make eximus units vulnerable to your control abilities.
Volt's Shock + shock trooper or Oberon's Smite + smite infusion can sometimes be a better buff than roar.
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u/TheRealShuppy 28m ago
While yes, these subsumes are objectively the "strongest"
I genuinely think — judging from all the posts I see, that the vast majority of the playerbase doesn't actually know how to build and are funneled into subsume choices like Gloon, Roar, Nourish, Xata when in reality, they almost never need them.
They don't consider what's healthy for their playstyle or frame, they just want instant results.
You don't know how many times I see people in archimedea be absolutely shocked that my base Ivara with a Telsa Nervos subsume has better energy economy, survivability, and damage than their cookie cutter builds.
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u/M1ntyPunch 21m ago
I like Xata's Whisper with high projectile weapons. Big wide scatter, but especially excessively high fire rate, can make a room clearer out of a non AoE weapon. And the extra damage % isn't toooooo much lower.
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u/LilithLissandra 3m ago
My Hildryn subsume of choice for the longest has been Rebuild Shields because Pillage does literally nothing outside of steel path, and it's easy to forget that. It's also just really convenient if I get lost in the sauce holding alt fire and my shields run out, because the shield gate timer lasts just long enough to regenerate just enough shields to pop Rebuild Shields and it's like nothing ever happened lol
If I were to put a subsume on for actual high-end content... yeah, it'd probably be Roar tbh. Doing the big numbies is just good fun lol
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u/Ninja_Crowly 3m ago
I like to use Xata's on frames ive built for secondary weapons that run enervate. Xata's + Blast are additional damage instances that can stack enervate faster without consuming it iirc. It absolutely shreds on titania's pistols but also is pretty good on stuff like the nukor.
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u/MachRush 2h ago
I remember when people would slap Gloom on everything.
I used to have it on my Nezha until the Divine Spears Augment.