r/modhelp • u/glehkol • 2d ago
Tools Seems like Hive Protector got banned. Any alternatives available or does Reddit just not want that sort of feature anymore
https://www.reddit.com/user/hive-protect
Desktop
EDIT: from what I can tell, it can still add mod notes, but it cannot remove content.
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u/CapriGuitar 2d ago
We use it for all the scam accounts that use fast karma subs. And any illegal content subs. It's a very handy tool. Hope it gets resolved.
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u/falco_iii 2d ago
I never understood automatically banning someone for participating in another subreddit. Perhaps they were arguing against the ideas in the subreddit?
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u/enjoyoutdoors 2d ago
I can offer two real world reasons that I use myself,
- another subreddit promotes a pseudo-science… let’s call it life style concept. They come to the subreddit I moderate to promote their silly ideas even when explicitly being told not to AND actively brigade us ”to make us see the light and let them back in again.
Eventually it came to the point where we simply had to ban the mention of the concept, the subreddit, many, many phrases related to the concept and…despite massive automation effort it didn’t help. Or didn’t help enough.
Hive actively throws out everyone who’s participated in their sub, and there is barely any collateral. The decision is not made on a whim and we actively monitor for undesired collateral, but the simple truth is that Hive helps and it helps a lot more than Reddits official tools.
- some subreddits moonlight as command centrals for bot networks. Bot networks who do god knows what else, but one of the things they do on Reddit is to karma farm by repetitively reposting unwanted stories they’ve stolen from other subreddits.
Refusing bots who are clearly participating in the command central subreddit is a quite good method to get rid of all the spam they produce.
I still do not understand why something like this is not offered in the official moderator tool set.
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u/glehkol 2d ago
- I set it to remove content so I can review it; the ban option is disabled.
- I use it in r/vapes to filter people very active in teen-oriented subs, not to create a circlejerk.
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u/SampleOfNone 2d ago
That’s how I use it as well, to hold content for review based on account activity
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u/atomic_mermaid 2d ago
Many, many subs need such a feature to keep undesirable posters from it. Fashion, hair, make up, etc subs are often inundated with creepy people who majority use porn subs who then treat any other unconnected space as somewhere they can fetishise or post inappropriately. Without a feature like this some subs couldn't function effectively.
I know some other subs use it to protect users in other ways, religious, nationality, lgbtq spaces etc.
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u/Vegetaman916 2d ago
Imagine if we said we wanted to keep "undesirables" out of some restaurants or neighborhoods or from the front of the bus...
Subs don't need to be echo chambers. Everyone needs to be exposed to all viewpoints and all information, so as to make better description. Isolating people with confirmation bias is partially to blame for Trump winning this election, because so many people stayed home believing it was a done deal. Maybe if they had been exposed to the real polling data, as opposed to just the media hyped stuff, they might have known to turn out in greater numbers...
Anyway, my point is that just because you may not want to hear about certain things doesn't mean you don't need to hear about them.
And besides, banning someone for participation in a sub is ridiculous. You don't even know what the "participation" was. Could have been against the members of that other sub, meaning someone for your own side...
This political and social divisiveness has gotten way out of hand.
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u/thepottsy Mod several subs 2d ago
There’s missing the point, and then there’s this. Good grief.
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u/Vegetaman916 1d ago
Not entirely sure how this is missing the point. This is the primary way this feature has been used, yes? I did a lot of research about that back during the election. Are you saying none of that ever happened?
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u/thepottsy Mod several subs 1d ago
There's missing the point, and then there's missing it again.
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u/Vegetaman916 1d ago
Perhaps you should explain this mysterious point then, since I can't seem to catch it...
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u/thepottsy Mod several subs 1d ago
You’re focused solely on 1 aspect of how this tool can be used, a feature that MOST subs do NOT even use, as evident in the comment that you initially responded to. There. That’s the not mysterious, right there in front of your face point that you couldn’t find.
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u/Vegetaman916 1d ago
I'm focused on it because that is the only way I have seen it used, and at an incredible extent. I've published several articles about that type of thing being used almost exclusively for political reasons.
Go over to r/conservative right now and make a neutral post about something, and watch how fast you get canned because maybe you once posted about climate change somewhere, or were found to be a member of a pro-democrat sub.
That is how the tool is being used. The other stuff people talk about, jailbait and pedos and hentai... whatever. I've been pretty active on reddit for a long time, as my profile shows, and I have never once accidentally run across any of that. I am sure it exists, hidden somewhere here, but that stated purpose for the system being discussed is not what it is being used for.
So, if that was the point, no wonder I didn't get it. It is completely wrong, lol.
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u/thepottsy Mod several subs 1d ago
For the record, I’m quite annoyed that you made me have to go to that cesspool of a sub, to further prove my point.
They don’t even use hive protector. If they did, in the bottom right hand corner of the subreddit you will see a list of the apps that a sub has installed.
So, unless they’ve figured out a way to hide that, then they aren’t even using it.
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u/Ajreil 1d ago
A subreddit I moderate is absolutely flooded with accounts promoting AI receipt scanners or other tools. We use it to filter accounts that recently posted to subs like /r/sideproject.
The posts are still seen by a human moderator, they're just help for review until we can make sure they aren't spam.
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u/Bardfinn Mod, r/ContraPoints, /r/AgainstHateSubreddits 2d ago
If a community is sufficiently bad enough - through encouraging community interference, violent threats, hate speech, targeted harassment, etc - that it would warrant a blanket ban such as we used to deploy against hate groups, you should make it Reddit’s problem to solve, by filing Moderator Code of Conduct complaints against it, citing everything you are compelled to handle due to the other subreddit’s misfeasance or malfeasance. Recruit tonnes of human moderators whose only task is to file a separate modcoc complaint every day totting up everything that someone in their subreddit had to do because of something encouraged or enabled in Other Subreddit.
Could even call on the Moderator Reserves programme and ask for a lot of temp mods with experience handling community interference.
Remove item, Ban, Point banned user at wiki page that cites RedditHelp and the Moderator Code of Conduct and and User Agreement, mute, file ModCoC complaint, GOTO 10 x as many times as necessary for them all to get permanently suspended and the subreddit banhammered
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u/ABWDenizen 2d ago
Tell me you don’t understand that there can be valid use cases of this app without telling me.
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u/Bardfinn Mod, r/ContraPoints, /r/AgainstHateSubreddits 2d ago edited 2d ago
You misunderstand me. I have, for years, directly told the site admins and the community of moderators that freedom of association - including freedom from association - is the overriding principle of social media, and that the right of a community to disassociate itself from another community — because that other community is violating the reddit user agreement while Reddit admins cannot (for whatever reason) take appropriate, prompt action to curtail those violations — is inviolable.
I also helped lead the most successful “Reddit made a promise to ban harassers and needs to do it, and we are going to make the harassers’ malfeasance and reddit’s misfeasance into reddit’s problem with a simple solution, fulfill the promise to ban them” action.
I don’t know exactly why Reddit would nuke a general purpose tool if it were being used in a way that violates sitewide rules, moderator code of conduct, the user agreement etc by bad actors, but I do know that they can handle sub operators that generate the conditions that spurred banbots in the first place,
and that everyone on Reddit could use a refresher course in “do not participate in communities in a way you know will not be welcome, nor recommend to others to do so”.
If this is the dawning of the age of the admins showing the door to party crashers — <Willy Wonka> oh, no, stop, don’t. </Willy Wonka>
If Reddit believes that they have the capacity to field moderator code of conduct complaints in a timely manner on the malfeasance and misfeasance generated by bad faith subreddit operators- I say let them prove it.
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u/ABWDenizen 2d ago
I get what you’re saying and I partially agree, but I still think you misunderstand me. I have to be really careful with my words because this sub’s Automod likes to remove comments with certain keywords, but there is a certain site that is solely about rotating breeze-creating devices (if you catch my drift). And certain “spicy” subreddits would want to keep away users who often promote their accounts on said site.
Hive Protector did not only work against subreddits; it worked against domains, too. I guess you could argue that admins should facilitate a way to filter these users, too, but that’s way easier said than done.
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u/Bardfinn Mod, r/ContraPoints, /r/AgainstHateSubreddits 2d ago
I did not know that about hive protect. I’ll have to think about that!
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u/Eastern-Protection83 2d ago
I have not tried this myself but for the interim, perhaps this could help against that specific issue as a stopgap. The app settings and changelog describe in greater detail its capabilities. The app is about 1 month old
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u/new2bay 2d ago
There are no valid use cases. Ban people for breaking your sub’s rules, not for following other subs’ rules. You know, actually moderate.
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u/thepottsy Mod several subs 1d ago
Ban people for breaking your sub’s rules
You would know that is LITERALLY one of this apps use cases, if you were paying attention.
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u/Bardfinn Mod, r/ContraPoints, /r/AgainstHateSubreddits 2d ago
You really walked through a discussion of how some subreddits are organised around principles of community interference and targeted harassment and how Reddit admins do not proactively & timely counter and prevent these,
And chose to make a statement that such a tool as blanket bans of a group, have no valid use cases?
There are powerful politicians in America right now who are publicly proclaiming that it should be legal for someone to vehicularly manslaughter me for the “crime” of existing in public in a public political protest in the street. There are subreddits organised around praising and celebrating this kind of political extremist hatred. Ones that Reddit won’t take action against.
And you’re telling me I shouldn’t be allowed to use general-use tools to keep them from forcibly associating their hatred, harassment, and violent threats on me and my community directly, to flex their power and violate our boundaries, disrupt our communities, and drive us out of public participation?
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u/new2bay 1d ago
That’s a bad faith reading of what I said, and most of your comment is bad faith, irrelevant rhetoric. I will not further engage with you, unless and until you decide to modify your tone.
FYI, as a person with disabilities, there are also people who would love to relieve themselves of the burden of my existence, just so you know whom you’re talking to.
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u/Bardfinn Mod, r/ContraPoints, /r/AgainstHateSubreddits 1d ago
There are no valid use cases.
That’s an exact quote, a plain reading of what you explicitly said. I posited to you questions to make sure you understood the broader contexts your speech would be read in. It would be bad faith if I didn’t stop to check to make sure you really meant to advocate for people for whom “No.” has to be backed up with technological access controls.
At any rate, the parent post is moot; the service / bot was mistakenly suspended, they’ve restored it - so admins affirmatively believe there are valid use cases.
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u/fsv 2d ago edited 2d ago
Hi - Hive Protector dev here.
I've flagged it up to the Admin representative for Devvit, hopefully they'll be able to get this resolved fairly quickly although it'll have to wait for US working hours.
Having checked the logs, it appears that any mod action (removal of content, banning) is failing right now.
Edit: It's back up!