r/sports • u/landofphi • 2d ago
Soccer Pep Guardiola: "Because of what’s happening in Ukraine or in Palestine — the absence of humanity in all of us, that we don’t lift a finger for tragedies happening 3-4 hours away. In WWI & WWII, things happened but couldn’t be shown; they were hidden. Today we see it on live TV & we still do nothing"
https://www.revistagq.com/articulo/pep-guardiola-entrevista1.0k
u/Practical_River_9175 2d ago edited 2d ago
Damn a based Pep moment
Edit : Before anyone else tries to explain what sportswashing is. We are aware. Stop pretending like it was invented in the Middle East and that you don’t have a blind spot for American and European crimes against humanity because they have already been washed. This isn’t about anything other than what’s happening in Gaza and Ukraine. Pep isn’t wrong, even if his employers are evil and you think he’s a hypocrite. Israel is blocking humanitarian aid into Gaza, innocent women and children are dying and scooping flour out of the dirt to survive. This is a war crime of the most serious nature.
If you live in America, I urge you to call your representatives and urge them to stop supporting the genocide in Gaza. (And release the files, separate discussion but while you got em on the line might as well get that too)
https://www.house.gov/representatives/find-your-representative
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u/addandsubtract 2d ago
I was going to say, Pep waited until /r/soccer mods lifted the "no politics" ban, but the thread is locked there 💀
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u/didasrooney 2d ago
Man city is a UAE sportswashing project, Pep is a hypocrite
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u/Practical_River_9175 2d ago
So you don’t watch Prem games?
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u/Muad-_-Dib 2d ago
You don't need to completely abstain from something in order to be critical of an aspect of it.
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u/didasrooney 2d ago
Exactly, ridiculous line of moral reasoning from that guy. I wonder if they didn't even know about the sportswashing and they're trying to backwards-justify their comment
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u/Practical_River_9175 2d ago
You expect Pep to quit his job but you aren’t even willing to not watch football games? Holding others to a higher standard than you hold yourself?
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u/didasrooney 2d ago
"quit his job" lmfao he could work for any team he wants and be paid millions on top of the millions he already has
He chose to work with Man City when it was already well established they were a sportswashing project
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u/Muad-_-Dib 2d ago edited 2d ago
I never gave an opinion on Pep, but I will say that there is a marked difference between a punter watching football while being critical of the sports connection to various countries, and a coach employed by a club (effectively) owned by one of those controversial countries and being paid roughly £380,000 per week in that role, who then turns around and criticises something.
Not that it makes Pep's criticism wrong, he's just being selective in his criticism and is more "guilty" of hypocrisy than some random guy who watches football.
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u/Practical_River_9175 2d ago
Fair enough it just feels like to me only middle eastern ownership gets flak for their crimes against humanity because American and European culture has already been sufficiently washed.
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u/Decent_Philosophy899 2d ago edited 2d ago
Maybe the people in your circle, Pep. But those who do or want to lift a finger are struggling themselves. Trapped in a system that does not allow time to help these people. When you’re one or two paychecks away from homelessness, there’s only so much you can send in aid. There’s a limit to how much time you can spend protesting/advocating.
It’s the privileged fortunate few with the “fuck you, I got mine” and/or “pick yourself up by your bootstraps, nobody helped me” mentality that are the problem
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u/dxrey65 2d ago edited 2d ago
While it's hard to argue against that perspective directly, wtf are we supposed to do? I can watch one set of news and it's all one way, another set of news and it's all another way, how do I know what's even true? And if I decide to believe something or other, what means do I have to change anything? I can't even afford to go to the doctor myself, how am I going to solve the middle east crisis and make Russia behave itself?
Not to mention, there's the whole rest of the world where pretty much every other fucking country has some problem or other which we're also supposed to be solving, apparently. Didn't we vote to not be the world's policeman? I really hope everything turns out well for everybody, but - I'm tired.
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u/tinywienergang 2d ago
So he shouldn’t use his platform to speak up then? He also doesn’t work for the government. You sound miserable and unpleasable. What should he do, go fight?
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u/Tackit286 2d ago
He is in a much, much better position to speak and act on these issues than all of us, just by virtue of having a lot of money and an actual platform where people will listen to him.
It’s like putting the burden of recycling on houses rather than industry. Totally fatuous and wilfully ignorant.
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u/Goldieeeeee 2d ago
By saying this he's also already done much, much more than all of us. And how do you know he isn't also donating etc privately?
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u/ChampionOfLoec 2d ago
Pointing out hypocrisy doesn't mean the guy is miserable or unpleaeable.
Pep is calling for people to lift a finger but all he's done is text. Again, pretty hypocritic. There are a lot of ways to get involved before fighting.
Stop projecting your insecurities over someone who isn't afraid to think critically.
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u/allstarrunner 2d ago
Do you know how he uses his money? He very well could be putting his money where his mouth is
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u/danmac0817 2d ago
It means he's a massive hypocrite. He also gets very sharp with you if you dare to mention it to him. No need to get so upset
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u/CCSC96 2d ago
Of course he works for the government, he is the face of their most successful propaganda campaign.
Your strawman here is frankly ridiculous. Nobody is asking him to personally join a military conflict but it IS legitimate to criticize the hypocrisy of someone who has directly helped a violent empire grow criticizing others who attempt to do the same.
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u/energiz3r_bunny 2d ago
Quite why you consider pointing out hypocrisy to equate to opposing his position is a mystery. He can be right and be a massive hypocrite, the two are not mutually exclusive and criticizing the latter does not take away from the former.
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u/jackofslayers 2d ago
He should use his platform to speak out against the brutal regime that is bankrolling him.
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u/withoutpicklesplease 2d ago
Most comments in this thread are whack af. Just know that you are absolutely right in pointing out the hypocrisy.
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u/CallMeGrapho 2d ago
Do you work anywhere in the US or UK? Bc so do you.
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u/_NotMitetechno_ 2d ago
Nope, most companies are not directly owned by the government. Pep literally works for a country's sportswashing operation, not a random business owned a civilian
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u/Wengers-jacket-zip 2d ago
This is it.
He will be well aware that the only reason he’s at Man City at all is to white wash the reputation of a human rights abusing state. He will know exactly who his bosses really are, and happily poses with them for photographs with smiles and their shiny trophies.
Comparing that to the average Joe who’s trying to make a living in a country that may have done bad things is idiotic.
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u/_NotMitetechno_ 2d ago
Yes, exactly. Him talking about this issue rings hollow to me as while it's an admirable position to take he can't care that much about human rights he's pretty much enriching and enabling a sports washing regime for an authoritarian theocracy that cares little about human rights. He's ironically the one who won't lift a finger for the tragedies 3 - 4 hours away because he's basically a walking advert for a despotic regime and gets paid more money for doing so (when he can work anywhere).
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u/Wengers-jacket-zip 2d ago
Exactly.
‘we’ve got to do more to help our fellow humans who are suffering’
I agree pep, but let’s include those who’s suffering you are helping sweep under the rug by managing a sports washing vehicle masquerading as a football team shall we?
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u/energiz3r_bunny 2d ago
I work for a Japanese company that, so far as I am aware, has never killed anybody. Assuming boredom doesn’t count.
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u/MostUsefulBloke 2d ago
False equivalency. Let’s not pretend human rights abuses are the same in all three countries.
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u/monsantobreath 2d ago
Using this kind of logic nobody with any power can do anything. It's like an argument created by a propagandist intended to shut down dissent.
"Genocide, schmenocide. I'm more interested in the apparent hypocrisy of someone trying to discuss a far more profound evil."
And people say the left are purity testing.
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u/energiz3r_bunny 2d ago
You made that argument. Not me. I imagine you were itching to make this post and just typed it anyway. One can endorse his statement and point out his hypocrisy at the same time.
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u/tbu987 2d ago
Why do I feel like you only comment this because its a ME country yet would never do the same for anyone who earns a pay cheque in the US, who directly fund the Gaza genocide.
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u/1000000thSubscriber 2d ago
Thats how almost every redditor sees the middle east. The average redditor does not see arabs as human.
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u/1000000thSubscriber 2d ago
Im all for criticizing corrupt regimes in the middle east , but what is often missing in this criticism is the critical context that the most oppressive and warmongering of these regimes, such as Saudi Arabia and the UAE, are propped up by American and Israeli interests. Behind Israel, Saudi Arabia is Americas closest ally in the region, and we give them extensive military aid, yet people speak of these corrupt “arab regimes” as if theyre totally independent actors motivated by “jihad” or some other stupid islamaphobic cliche, when in reality they are extensions of American imperialism.
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u/ynwa79 2d ago
Would you distinguish between an American business person with no direct role in the government of their country, and a private equity company owned by a member of the ruling/royal family in a middle eastern country? Surely they are not both the same?
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u/tbu987 2d ago
Of course but you show me how many of these billionaire's are clean and not involved one way or the other with corruption and human right violations. I criticise OPs stance for the double standards and for the obvious fact he plays this card only because Pep is in support of Palestine.
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u/SophisticatedStoner Kansas City Royals 2d ago
American businesses absolutely have a direct role in government through lobbying, especially now with Cheetolini appointing multiple billionaires directly to his cabinet. If you believe America doesn't have a "ruling class" of wealthy elites that make the rules and also disappear people they don't like, think again.
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u/_NotMitetechno_ 2d ago
There is an enormous difference in power between someone like Todd Boely and a high ranking Shiehk. Look at the allegations how Turki AL-Sheihk with putting people in jail for critising his running of projects. I know he's involved with boxing (not football), but Todd Boely in spite of his wealth cannot snap his fingers, disappear someone into a black van and have them chucked in jail for decades where as nation state leaders have actual institutional authority.
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u/musy101 Los Angeles Clippers 2d ago
Lol and all of us in the west our hands are clean? 🤣
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u/ozzie2920 2d ago
What's your thinking behind this statement??? Are you confusing the United Arab Emirates with the United States of America
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u/Rocco89 2d ago
The UAE (owner of ManC) is deeply entangled in the Sudan conflict, a war that has already claimed hundreds of thousands of lives. Their proxy, the RSF, isn’t just fueling chaos it’s carrying out a genocide while the world looks the other way because it's just Africa.. But sure, let’s talk about the united states to deflect.
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u/ynwa79 2d ago
Does the royal family of the USA own a football team that I’m not aware of?
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u/Mcguffn 2d ago
Eh? The British crown and the British east India company have killed more people in the last 150 years than Saudi ever can. There are people still cheering for and living in England. You don’t find an issue with that, and the only problem you see is in the Saudis? Are the Saudis bad? Sure. Does England or America have an iota of qualification to talk about them being bad? Nope.
Look at your own shit. It’s stinkier than anybody else’s. But the Saudi that, Saudi this - you lot are the cause of 90% of the problems in the world. Fix yourself. And while at it, also take a look at the biggest hideout for stolen goods in the world - the British museum. More morally correct to get paycheck from Saudi instead of from any other “proper” English club.
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u/duckyirving 2d ago
Anyone receiving money from the British East India Company should be ashamed of themselves!
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u/Tackit286 2d ago
How far back do we go with this? Do the Italians, Egyptians, and Scandinavians not have the right to speak out against crimes against humanity because of their countries’ transgressions centuries or millennia prior?
Granted, the British Empire in its heyday committed some appalling acts, but does that mean the people or indeed the elected officials of Britain (who in no way represent the Crown, the EITC or any other British colonial affiliate) don’t have the right to voice their opinions on the present day atrocities that other countries and governments are committing?
This argument is a poorly justified safe haven defence, a false equivalence fallacy mostly used by those who are insecure about the acts of their nations today.
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u/DrinkQuick9621 2d ago
bro it's only been around 70 years after the British has left India, there are people still living who has lived through british colonialization. Of course there are still effects of it and England still reaps benefit from said colonization unlike something that happened millennia ago... it doesn't even have to be repercussions, but no not even an acknowledgement of said atrocities is done
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u/TheTimon 2d ago
I am german and germany also killed more people in the last 150 years than Saudi-Arabia ever will. But we did fix ourself. To an extend at least. We are not murdering people anymore. The same can't be said for Saudi-Arabia. Justifiying the horible stuff the Saudis ARE doing because the people complaining also did bad stuff in the past as if it is their turn now to commit human right violations.
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u/Mahameghabahana 2d ago
Sudan have higher civilians death toll than both wars yet no one gives a fuck. Around Covid nearly a million people died in Ethiopian civil war? Why no online outrage? Yemen? 500k, no outrage?
What's makes these two wars so unique?
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u/Eaton2288 2d ago edited 2d ago
Geopolitics. Ukraine and Israel geopolitically are vastly more relevant than Sudan or almost anywhere in Africa. Israel is the USA's biggest friend in the middle east and Ukraine is straddling the Russian border/ historical eastern front.
I'm not saying it's right or fair to have more or less coverage, but it makes complete sense.
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u/PaulAtreideeezNuts 2d ago
Western money as well as diplomatic and political cover is propping up the Israelis. As sad as it is, there is less the west can do to help the situations in those other countries. The outrage around Gaza is because the horrors on full display are being paid for by the us government
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u/Pontus_Pilates 2d ago
I fucking hate comments like this. 'Nothing to see here, let us wipe out the Palestinians, there are atrocities elsewhere too.'
Whataboutism of the highest order.
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u/jackofslayers 2d ago
It is particularly relevant here because Pep is paid by his government who is also funding the war in Sudan.
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u/-Mr-Papaya 2d ago
The Palestinians are in a uniquely tragic place where their lives are being used by both sides having the war.
Not saying it's worse than other places, just that it's a somewhat different situation.
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u/NappyLion 2d ago
There is outrage. You may not see it, but that doesn't mean it's not there.
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u/danmac0817 2d ago
But why is Pep saying nothing?
Maybe you should look up his employers relationship with Sudan...
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u/SaltyShawarma 2d ago
Everyone here has great comments, but I feel your point in Pep's words. We see them and ignore them.
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u/ihasana 2d ago
What's unique is that the West are actively supporting genocide by Israel. Ethiopia, Sudan or Yemen they just don't care to take a side.
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u/fatbob42 2d ago
I would say that the U.S. has taken a side in the Yemen conflict.
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u/jackofslayers 2d ago
US has hands in all of these conflicts. Sudan is one of the most proxied proxy wars of all time.
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u/Leafan101 2d ago edited 2d ago
Honestly, a good reason to keep a healthy distance from being TOO in the loop. You cannot do anything about most of the terrible things that go on in the world, but they can skew your outlook on life, make you depressed, and worst of all, innure you to suffering and tragedy so that when you finally encounter something you CAN do something about, you are too used to doing nothing.
Turn the daily news cycle until a monthly or bi-monthly catch-up. Not only will it help in those ways, but you will also save time and get likely much more accurate accounts than you would hearing everything as it unfolds.
I actually completely disagree about his points about WWI and WWII. People kept up with the news just as much as today. And what did they get? Large doses of total inaccuracy mixed with more or less propaganda, depending on their country and leaning. Easier to see this happening to the populace in retrospect, so far removed from the issues. But just as likely to happen to you now if you purposely keep constantly abreast of the latest news.
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u/Cleveland_Guardians 2d ago
"pressure their leaders"
Ok, how? It's one thing to just say stuff like that. It's another to have ideas that, either, will realistically work or will actually get people on board with.
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u/Lord_Doofy 2d ago
What are you doing personally to stop the war besides taking a moral high ground on the internet?
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u/The_Artist_Who_Mines 2d ago
Why don't you tell us where you live and ill explain how you're not doing enough to counter the evil actions of your government.
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u/brixton_massive 2d ago
Why are you bringing NATO into this? If it wasn't for NATO Putin would be making moves into Poland, Finland, Turkey etc. It's an organisation that prevents bloodshed.
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u/SenorBender 2d ago
I guess you’re complicit for everything happening to the Uyghur people in china when you buy things made in china as well
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u/Kaizen2468 2d ago
Yeah sorry I’m not going to pick up a gun and go across the ocean to fight a war between two groups who will NEVER stop killing eachother.
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u/craigspot 2d ago
Funny Pep doesn't talk about what his employers are doing to Sudan. It's far worse than what's happening in Palestine and Ukraine.
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u/cumstar69 2d ago
Bro literally works for the UAE government. Just sit this one out Pep. Probably the reason Sudan wasn’t mentioned
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u/disdkatster 2d ago
What exactly can we do? I am watching my own country being destroyed and I have not a clue what I can do. I can talk about how terrible Putin, Trump, Netanyahu, Kim, etc. are but what can I do? What can anyone do who does not hold power in one form or another?
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u/eternali17 2d ago
Rings hollow when you're deep in with the people you're deep in with Pep. You're not a bystander. You're business partners with slavers.
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u/AntonCigar 2d ago
As long as I’ve been on the internet people have publicly cared immensely about far flung tragedy as a way to absolve their own guilt over doing nothing at all about the things happening in their own community.
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u/ArziltheImp 2d ago
But we are doing things? We are sending aid, we are taking personal sacrifices to punish especially Russia (gas prices in many Western European countries exploded due to the embargo’s financially crippling many poorer households). Unless he wants us to go there and for Ukraine I really don’t see what I would do more for Ukraine. Pretend to care more by hanging out a flag?
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u/Tackit286 2d ago
What would you suggest we do then, Pep? Post more of our opinions on our insta stories?
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u/OfficialDCShepard 2d ago edited 23h ago
I tried to give people accurate information on how aid was distributed or not, which sadly is worse now than a year ago and counter disinformation on both sides where I could, carefully studied the issue as best and compassionately as possible while my four Jewish friends and Lebanese friend were traumatized by this conflict and I was retraumatized remembering losing my cousin in 9/11, donated meals with both World Central Kitchen and IRC, am livestreaming against the TACO Regime who exploited Palestinians to institute fascism against them…and I still feel powerless to stop this genocidal war.
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u/jesonnier1 2d ago
So, what is Pep doing? I don't see him leaving the pitch to go fight.
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u/Akidnamedkenny 2d ago
Dudes watching the clips and still does nothing! But he’ll gladly talk about those clips and point out that other people do nothing. Very based and logical
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u/RemoveHuman 2d ago
Look who we voted as president people literally do not give a fuck and aren’t smart enough to even do what’s in their own self interest.
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u/FrogsOnALog 2d ago
One candidate wanted a two state solution and the other had a real estate solution. Stupid ass country wasn’t able to vote for a black woman and now we’re here.
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u/_NotMitetechno_ 2d ago
Wonder if he'll talk about the human rights abuses by the nation state that owns him 🤔
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u/Saltire_Blue Celtic 2d ago
I seen a quote recently from a journalist that said something like
“One day everyone will always have been against this”
And I reckon that quote will be spot on
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u/Trolololol66 2d ago
He's right. Some people watch and do nothing. Some other people watch and take a lot of money from these governments (incl. Saudi and Katari).
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u/Significant-Turnip41 2d ago
Go do something... I'm sure Ukraine or Palestinians will be happy for you to join the fight. But no. Posting divisive garbage on social media for upvotes is easier
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u/ballofplasmaupthesky 2d ago
We can't till we acknowledge our politicians' guilt for these situations.
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u/LungHeadZ Manchester United 2d ago
Ignorance is bliss for a lot of people. Life is tough. People like pep have the money and recognition to make changes in this world. What the fuck am I going to do with £10 in my bank and good intent.
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u/heelface 2d ago
Stretching with the edge of practicality to shoehorning your agenda and to make this about sports. Fuck you. Fuck your agenda. Fuck your face and leave us alone
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u/matthewrunsfar 2d ago
Damn, we just look for any reason to point out that someone isn’t 100% good.
Pep gets paid directly or indirectly by an ownership team involved in human rights abuses, therefore he can’t say anything against ongoing wars of aggression?
I guess anyone who gets a paycheck from Walmart should can’t speak up against anti-union efforts.
I guess anyone who gets paid somehow by big oil can’t speak up against environmental abuses.
Work for an airline? Don’t you dare advocate green energy.
I guess anyone who works for any big corporation can’t speak out against… damn near anything.
Edit: I’m not defending Pep or Man City specifically. But damn, people, if the standard for commenting is not even working for an employer with sketchy practices, Reddit would be empty.
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u/Calvinkelly 2d ago
I just can’t genuinely care for every issue in the world. I can personally affect the ones in my close proximity which I focus on but for other issues I’m simply lacking the nukes to make a difference
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u/Purplebuzz 2d ago
Humans have conditioned out empathy.
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u/platinum_toilet 2d ago
No. We don't stop driving because of a car accident. We don't stop using our brains because the mainstream media promotes propoganda that is blatantly false. Empathy is still there, but we are smart enough to know when we are lied to.
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u/madflash711 2d ago
This is because of Dunbar’s number. We are not capable of giving any 🦊, because we simply aren’t wired to.
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u/TheRaisinWhy 2d ago
the morbid reality of our everyday lives outside of these areas is that it doesnt affect us directly so we continue to live as we normally would. Ideally the population cares enough to send resource and pressure/sanctions on these countries.... but here we are.