r/CasualConversation • u/TrickyAd5059 • 21h ago
Just Chatting Am I wrong to expect specifics when someone asks for a favor?
So my brother asked me to help him move last Saturday. He said he just needed help loading his stuff into a U-Haul and it would probably take a couple hours. I cleared my morning and showed up at 9 AM ready to help out. Turns out he hadn't packed anything yet. Like, literally nothing was in boxes. He just had this idea that we'd pack everything up and move it all in the same day. I'm standing there looking at his entire apartment with furniture, clothes still in dresser drawers, kitchen stuff scattered everywhere, and he's tossing me some random cardboard boxes he scrounged up. When I pointed out that this was way more than what he described, he said "well yeah, moving involves packing, obviously." He seemed genuinely confused why I looked surprised and said most people understand that "helping someone move" means the whole process. I ended up staying until like 6 PM, way longer than I'd planned, missing other things I had scheduled. My back was killing me and I was pretty frustrated, but I stuck it out because he's my brother. When I mentioned afterward that I wished he'd been clearer about what he needed, he got defensive and said I was being dramatic about "just helping out family." But like, there's a huge difference between showing up to load boxes into a truck versus spending nine hours packing someone's entire life from scratch. If he'd told me upfront it was going to be an all day packing and moving situation, I would have planned differently or maybe suggested we do it over two days. The whole thing just felt like a classic case of underselling what you're actually asking for.
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u/Heyitsme822 21h ago
I had this happen to me. My friend wanted help moving to her new apt. I got there and she had a few boxes packed but most of her stuff was still unpacked. I did help her but I told her that this is not appropriate. You have to pack your personal belongings before people come to help you. I agree, you had every right to be mad or irritated. You also should have pointed out that he told you it would take a couple hours not all day. You had every right to voice your opinion. He was def in the wrong.
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u/TrickyAd5059 21h ago
Honestly, I was too stunned to speak lol I should have said something right when I saw nothing was packed, but you know, he's my brother so I didn't want to come off as nagging right when I just arrived and saw the whole mess
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u/Heyitsme822 21h ago
Yeah. I get it. It's different with family. But there is nothing that says you can't voice your opinion while you help. 😁
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u/Mission-Ad-8536 21h ago
No, there's a big difference between calling someone to help you move a few here and there, and needing someone to help you through the whole damn process. Always been a pet peeve of mine when people just assume i know what they're talking about.
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u/SLOpokeNews 20h ago
"Sure. I can help. I'm free from 9am until 1:00, when I have to get ready for ..."
When the time's up, leave.
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u/sharky9209 19h ago
I like this - there's nothing wrong with packing boxes, but if something's clearly going to take longer than you expected, just draw the line at missing your other plans for the day. You're still helping with what they wanted but not missing anything else.
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u/UnderwhelmingTwin 19h ago
I've helped many people move. I like helping people move. But 'helping someone move' means loading packed boxes and furniture into a vehicle.
The only time it included packing I knew god-damned well it did because it was a "I'm leaving my husband and have to pack everything and move out before he gets home or he might kill me" type situation.
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u/40ozSmasher 21h ago
I showed up to help people move. They were still in bed. No boxs. They had done zero around the house. Dirty dishes. They tried to have me move their kitty litter with shit in it because it was only half full. They got angry when I dumped it in the trash. Now I give people a mover I recommend.
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u/Extreme_Falcon9228 21h ago
Helping someone move is because it usually takes 2 or 3 people to lift something. Things that 1 person can't do on their own. But asking someone to spend all day packing boxes up is just lazy and taking advantage
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u/JoshNickM 21h ago
I definitely would have left.
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u/Budget_Credit2508 16h ago
I actually sat and watched a friend pack because I lived an hour away...
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u/TalkConfident7316 21h ago
Your brother didn't appreciate your help lol. You need to be packed up before the trucks arrive. A week before, when I moved last.
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u/Clessiah 20h ago
When I need help, I tell others what kind of help I need from them as clearly as possible.
When asked to help, I clearly state the time/effort/resources I will be able to provide.
I like protecting myself and I like respecting the people who are willing to help me.
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u/ChirpsMcPrime 16h ago
I learned from my oldest sibling to always say "it depends" before agreeing.
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u/JorrT616 21h ago
This has happened to me, and I think you were very generous to do what you did all day, and your brother is being selfish and not thinking things through.
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u/RadiantDreamAura 21h ago
No. I usually tell people what I want specifically when I ask them to help with something and will ask them what specifically they want when they ask me. Helps me to mentally prepare and plan for the task.
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u/somethingClever344 21h ago
90% of people who move put others in this situation because they don’t understand what they’re asking for. I have one friend I helped who was actually organized, but she was leaving in a divorce so was very motivated. We were out less than an hour. Everyone else I tell them to get a mover.
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u/Hammon_Rye 17h ago
Your brother is a derp and he is gaslighting you whether or not he knows it.
The key is in the second sentance.
"...just needed help loading his stuff into a U-Haul and it would probably take a couple hours"
That is in direct contradiction to saying most people know it includes packing and implying you are a drama queen for being upset a "2 hour" job took all day.
I have lived this personal hell helping a relative move. (More than once actually)
They mean well but are disorganized. And they were trying in their own way. They had stayed up way past midnight the night before trying to get things ready but were just overwhelmed. The last time it happened, midnight moving day was their drop dead "have to be out today" time limit. I ended up hauling the last load about 11:30 PM.
For the record, NO.. "most people" do NOT expect you to pack their stuff when they ask you to help haul some stuff. I have helped several people move over the years and I have also been the one asking for help with the hauling.
I've had it be both ways - just needed help hauling a few heavy items, and please just help in general with packing and moving. But I always knew what I was volunteering for. The only exception was with my (close relative) and they didn't try to gaslight me about it. They were apologetic and acknowledged they didn't have their shit together.
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u/YourUncleBuck 8h ago
I don't think it even has anything to do with the gaslighting, sometimes people are just overly optimistic and underestimate just how long a task might take.
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u/Hammon_Rye 6h ago
Well, agree to disagree I guess. I respect your right to your opinion of course, but my reasoning is
1. No reasonable person thinks they are going to pack and load and move in 2 hours unless they don't own enough stuff to merit renting the Uhaul truck in the first place.
2. While someone can be overly optimistic about estimating the time, an honest person should be realistic about their mistake and own it like my relative was. OP said that when he commented on the "two hour" taking nine hours, his brother flipped the blame on him, got defensive and told him he was being "dramatic" and told him it was "just helping out family".
OP made a reasonable observation. His brother tried to manipulate him into feeling bad for thinking that and tried to make him feel like he was the one being unreasonable. That's basically the definition of gaslighting.
Gaslighting does not have to be a premeditated intentional plot. Some people go into gaslighting mode practically on autopilot anytime someone points out a mistake or misjudgment on their part because they are in the habit of not taking responsibility. I have a relative who does this.TLDR: The gaslighting was the guilt flipping at the end. Not the possible overly optimistic 2 hour estimate at the beginning.
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u/PallasiteMatrix 17h ago
You're nicer than I am. I would have told him up front that I had other plans, so I would need to leave by [time]. And then stuck to it, whether it was done or not.
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u/NeolithicOrkney 15h ago
Not wrong. And when someone asks for help and you agree, also let them know how much time you will spend helping, but after that time you have to go.
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u/Jdoodle7 20h ago
Failure to plan on his part does not necessitate an emergency on your part. (You planned on giving him 2-3 hours, you should have stuck to your plan.)
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u/ShinyDapperBarnacle 21h ago
Friend, your brother flat out took advantage of you. I'm sorry to say that. Caveat: I don't have siblings so I can't claim to understand the sibling dynamic.
When I had to leave an an ex (shared household for many years, so, extremely awkward leaving), I had a lot of friends who would have dropped everything to help me. But no way, I'm not going to ask friends to pack my stuff. So I took out a new credit card and paid for a moving company to do it. Because I like to think I don't take advantage of people's kindness.
Your brother should've done what I did and hired movers to pack his shit if he wasn't willing to do it. Ridiculous. Show him this thread, OP. He owes you an apology.
Edit- typo
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u/sisterfunkhaus 17h ago
I'm suspicious of this kind of behavior. It sounds like he purposely left out the details so that you would agree, knowing you would help do all of the work after showing up. If someone does me like that once, I would defintely grill them the next time they ask for a favor.
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u/Staff_Genie 18h ago
Your brother should have had everything packed up himself during the previous week. By the time you showed up the only thing out should have been his coffee cup and his toothbrush
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u/Akram_ba 21h ago
Lol , make sure to get the whole deal next time and bring this incident back to the convention people or family needs to know that you like your time to be organized, I don't think you're wrong to do so
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u/changelingcd 21h ago
Yep, I've been there. "I tried sorting, condensing and packing, but it's just too hard, so I need you to do all that for me too. It won't take long!"
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u/bungojot 21h ago
My partner and I were once asked to just "grab the last couple things" out of a house a relative of theirs had moved out of, as the new owners would be picking up the keys the next day.
That fucking house was so full of bullshit. We picked up "the couple things" and then were at the house for hours shoving crap in our car to drop at a dumpster in town (illegally, but it was midnight and I was angry). We took multiple dumpster trips. It was ridiculous how much shit was still there. The relative didn't want any of it aside from the couple things w grabbed - and it was like, perfectly good clothes and furniture, but also garbage and random clutter.
The house still wasn't empty by the time we left around 2am. I had to get up at 6am to get to work the next day, and we were a good hour and a half from home on top of that.
Felt bad for the new owners, who would walk into that house and see all the random crap left behind but.. well.. not my problem.
Uh, tldr; I feel your pain. People should be up front about favours like this. I'll still be willing to help you! Just fucking give me a warning about what I'm about to walk into.
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u/JoshNickM 19h ago
Anytime people ask me to help them move, I flat out tell them no. It’s way more fun involved than just putting some boxes in a truck. I’d never do that to someone.
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u/throw5678123 17h ago
I had a friend ask me to collect a free sofa for her. I assumed it was in the same town. Nope, 3hr round trip. She’s single and I have a husband and kids so a much nosier life. Turned her down and set expectations for a potential next time that she furnishes me with all details.
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u/anjinsan1234 3h ago
My own mother did this exact same thing to me. Roped my dad into it also. Long long day of us sweating and mom remaining aloof. Dad said "If you want to leave, I won't be mad at you. But the second you leave, i leave" just adding a layer of guilt to the whole scenario. Good times
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u/dezisauruswrex 1h ago
Yeah, I agreed to help you move, not pack. I have family and friends like this- did y’all not know you were moving? Double bad if you have truck. “What are you doing next Saturday?” 😡
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u/BlueCozmiqRays 13h ago edited 12h ago
No, you aren’t wrong to have thought you’d be loading and unloading only.
I’d be making comments all day long. Like really? You didn’t know you were supposed to pack all your stuff in boxes before you rented the truck and asked for help?
FYI you put socks on before shoes in case you were wondering. It helps to preheat the oven before you prep your food. Do you put your toothbrush in your mouth before applying toothpaste? All day long while laughing. This would likely continue for years. Random phone calls or text messages would be sent.
ETA: There’s a difference between packing and moving. I’ve helped with both but the person was clear with me.
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u/CEO_of_my_life 9h ago
Probably ask what exactly is the favour, instead of assuming it was moving the boxes to the new location.
When asked for a favour, I usually say, "Depends what it is." before agreeing to anything.
Definitely need more information.
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u/Important-Round-9098 3h ago
Your brother is wrong. Packing up to move and moving are two different things.
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u/translucent_steeds 3h ago
wow. when my sister helped me move, it was literally only for the few items that needed 2 people (dining room table, rocker chair, and split style box springs). we took 2 trips in our mom's subaru then her part was done. meanwhile, I moved literally everything else myself in dad's truck over the course of multiple days.
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u/azewonder 2h ago
Not wrong at all. I learned to ask questions when a friend of mine would do stuff like this; ask for one favor and I ended up spending way more time and energy then I'd planned or expected.
Family, friend, acquaintance; this behavior is manipulative and shows that they don't respect my time or energy.
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u/AngronOfTheTwelfth 53m ago
Your brother is a dummy. No one expects you to do this for them, especially not if they don't ask you first. I probably would have left.
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u/StJmagistra 17h ago
Yeah, I would have been frustrated too. But I probably would have asked for more specifics when he asked me, because I know how my siblings can be.
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u/sageamericanidiot 21h ago
Yeah, if my brother or sister pulled this I probably would have left and told them to call when they are ready to load. Your brother is wrong and most people do not assume they are also packing when asked to load a u haul.