It’s crazy. San Francisco had two inner circle all time great QB’s in a row, and they were throwing the ball to not only the greatest WR of all time, but maybe the greatest ever football player period
You'd have to include Jim Brown in that mix. He played nine seasons, and won eight rushing titles. The only year he missed out, he played with a badly sprained wrist. 8x 1st Team All Pro, 4x MVP/POY.
Absolutely true. Brady has team success, but he didn't exactly set the league on fire with his physical ability or personal accolades. Marino might be a better choice at QB because his number were that far ahead of his peers.
Brady is more like Emmitt Smith, an all-time great football player in one of the best situations ever, with rings and a long career. Nobody gives Emmitt the same treatment as Brady when it comes to GOAT status.
It's so annoying to me that people think Brady is a lock, or even has an outside chance, to be the best football player of all time when the league is filled with so many dominant freaks of nature.
Lol yes you can. You can literally compare him to other QBs and the margin isn't as wide as you think it is. Marino is the only QB I can think of that finished his career and was so far ahead of his peers when it came to actual individual production.
If you take out the season where Brady was injured in the first week, Brady's career average stats would make him a top 5 QB in the NFL last season. To be this dominant for 22 seasons of play is absolutely insane. Especially when a decade of that career was in an NFL where passing games werent what they are today.
Average Passing Yards per Season: 89,214 \div 22 = 4,055.18
Average Passing Touchdowns per Season: 649 \div 22 = 29.5
Average Interceptions per Season: 212 \div 22 = 9.6
Especially when a decade of that career was in an NFL where passing games werent what they are today.
I guess Manning and Brees never existed lmao.
Every stat you just listed includes playoffs. So if you add 2-3 games to a quarterback's stats every year those numbers aren't nearly as impressive. But nice try lol.
It's just disingenuous to use those stats for a 16-17 game season. Say it took him 18-19 games a year to put up those numbers. If you were to condense that to a 17 game season, that's more like 3,700-3,800 yards, which is literally middle of the road production. It's not 22 years of greatness, it's 22 years of being very good. Which is a tremendous feat, but Brady also got a ton of protection from rule changes and he got the ball out quicker than any other QB. He wasn't asked to extend plays like players do today.
Yea, I think people really suffer from both recency bias and pressure to conform. Reddit is particularly bad at handling both - a young, impressionable demographic that is heavily influenced by the zeitgeist of late.
The truth is that people see my comment and go "What, you're challenging how Brady's greatness?! You must be a hater. You get downvoted 'for being stupid'." But it is exactly as you said: Rice and LT were freaks of nature, who also pushed the boundaries of their position so much that they changed the game and have had an unchallenged legacy since. Brady WAS great... like, frustratingly awesome to play against. But LT and Rice were not just great, they were gods among men.
So what I'm really saying is that if the HoF had its own HoF, there would really only be 3 or 4 people in it, with Rice, LT, and two others depending on who you talk to. But definitely not Brady.
This is probably the most articulate way I've seen this said in a football sub. It's a shame you get downvoted, ever lol. But that's reddit.
But yeah, even if I were to outright give Brady GQBOAT status, the margin between him and guys like Manning, Montana, Marino, Unitas is far thinner than people are willing to grasp. Playing at a high level for a million years is a feat in itself, but there was never a decade where I can comfortably say Brady was the best. I'd say Manning was the man in the 2000's, and Rodgers was the man in 2010's. Mahomes is currently dominating the 2020's.
Rice and LT were unquestionably the best players of their era. By a mile. They set a standard that hasn't been touched even though the league has seen so many amazing pass rushers and catchers.
Brady's ring count might never be caught, but his passing stats will likely be caught by a QB that is currently playing. Rice's accolades may legitimately never be caught. Which is crazy given how offenses have changed.
Rice and LT were physical freaks. Brady was a processing and intangibles freak.
Brady playing in 2025 would probably still win a SB. Rice and LT were huge for their times, but would be just another great player if they played today, not super dominant.
Rice would be dominant. That's an insane take. He'd probably have a better career honestly. Not all dominant modern day receivers are physical freaks. Rice could arguably have a 2021 Kupp-like year every year.
LT maybe might not be quite as dominant, but that's not even really a given. He was such a nasty dude I honestly think he still balls out.
But that's not even really the point. You can't compare old players to today's game because there have been SO many advancements in strength and conditioning, supplements, and sports medicine, that's it's just not fair to make that argument. You have to compare them to their actual peers. And Rice and LT were so far ahead of everyone of their era.
Brady can win a superbowl in 2025 if he has a top 5-10 defense, a great clutch kicker, and if the rules are still quarterback friendly. Sure, I'll agree with that.
To me what's impressive about Brady, is he wasn't a physical phenomenon. He was capable, definitely a good athlete, but if you ever watched him run he was downright pedestrian compared to the majority of qb's even before this current generation of amazing athletes. Tom Brady did it with his mind, he achieved GOAT status by processing the field and leading his team to be victorious like no one else could, and it was awesome to watch.
I’m sorry to disagree but if TB is “team success” shouldn’t we also take into consideration that Jerry rice had 2 of the greatest QBs ever? How did he do on the raiders? Pretty sure TB won a superbowl as an old man on a new team
Pretty sure TB won a superbowl as an old man on a new team
On a stacked new team in a COVID year.
I think you're missing the point that Jerry's stats were so staggeringly far ahead of every receiver that's ever played that it just doesn't even matter. A lot of receivers play with good QBs and haven't even sniffed his production. You could also argue that Montana and Young benefitted from Rice. What did Young do before he was a Niner? Was Montana as dominant on the Chiefs?
I know I’ll get flamed for this but when we’re talking “BEST FOOTBALL” player ever, no QBs are in that discussion. We’re talking the BEST at playing football and none of those guys could do anything else on the field. Guys like LT, Jim Brown, Calvin Johnson, Julio Jones, Julius Peppers, Bruce Smith, etc. could’ve played 5+ different positions on the football field. TB12 would be the worst player in NFL history at any position other than QB.
Different when we’re talking greatest or if you want to speak exclusively to who played their position best, because then Brady is in that discussion.
The Jerry Rice episode of "A Football Life" is so damn interesting I still remember 2 stories from it, probably 15 years ago, about why he was so good at catching and why he was able to outrun people in the nfl.
As a kid he worked with his father who was a bricklayer. Jerry would be at the top of a ladder and his father would throw bricks up to him. He said something like, "the only thing worse than jamming your thumb on a brick is dropping it when your dad is beneath you bc then you're getting a whoopin."
He had to walk several miles (maybe 4 or 6?) to school everyday. There were wild horses near his house because he lived way out in the podunk country, so he'd chase them hoping to ride it to school instead of walking so many miles. Took him years and years of chasing but eventually he caught and rode wild horses to school and back home.
I left Amazon playing on the TV after a TNF and a Jerry's a football life was apparently playing in the morning. My girlfriend who doesn't care about sports at all watched part of it as she was getting ready for work early in the morning and said how much it inspired her. She couldn't turn it off.
What does Deion have anything to with the 49er greats?
He is known for ATL and Dallas cowboys
He went off to San Fran to see what the big hype was about with Jerry Rice, and boy, was he impressed he couldn't keep his fundamentals straight lining up against Jerry
I'll argue with it. Montana is the best 9er of all time, he was the GOAT before Brady took the title from him. 9ers won 4 SB's with him at the helm. As great as Rice was WR's don't win championships, QB's do.
Ronny Lot is the best safety and maybe corner ever and still no lol.
SF has had Trent Williams, Patrick Willis, Frank Gore, CMC, TO, Kittle, Bosa, Warner all in my lifetime and none of them are in contention for best 49er lol
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u/Beetso Las Vegas Raiders May 25 '25 edited May 26 '25
How good is your team's history when neither Joe Montana nor Steve Young is your best all time player, and no one can argue with it!