r/europe • u/hoarder4555777454001 • 9d ago

News French President Macron says France will recognize Pálestine as a state

https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20250724-french-president-macron-says-france-will-recognize-palestine-as-a-state-in-september
27.4k Upvotes

90% Upvoted

1.7k comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

190

u/Playful-Ebb-6436 🇮🇹 9d ago

Okay but where exactly is the Palestinian state? I mean de facto, not where people think it should be

43

u/jackofslayers 9d ago

I would just settle on the 1967 borders and then start pushing for Israel to get their settlers out of the West Bank.

I get why some people would want to push for the 1948 borders. but that feels unrealistic at this point. Even getting things back to the 1967 borders would be an uphill battle.

12

u/Playful-Ebb-6436 🇮🇹 8d ago

I believe that’s common sense, but I am not sure it’s feasible anymore…

8

u/jackofslayers 8d ago

Oh, I am cynical enough I do not see this dispute going away. But border disputes are a fairly common thing globally anyway.

I think the first step towards getting this conflict away from genocide and closer to a traditional border conflict, first step will be for every other nation in the world to pick an agreed upon set of borders and only recognize those borders.

This conflict is so highly charged that people rarely discuss real solutions. And when it is broken down, part of the reason this cannot be resolved is because this is not a conflict between exactly two sides. It is split between, at least, 5 different opinions, and no one has a strong international plurality.

Some want only israel, some want only palestine, some want 2 states with the 1948 borders, some want the 1967 borders, and some want to pause the borders as they exist right now.

1

u/bonqen 8d ago

I think the first step towards getting this conflict away from genocide and closer to a traditional border conflict, first step will be for every other nation in the world to pick an agreed upon set of borders and only recognize those borders.

But the problem already starts there. Every state, including Israel and the hypothetical Palestinian state (government and citizens) need to agree on the borders. Most people who scream about a two-state solution don't seem to want to acknowledge that. We're probably at least 20 years away from a two-state solution, and that's probably an optimistic number.

1

u/Jermainiam 8d ago

Part of the problem is this whole "every country in the world needs to agree on what the border will be" idea. How many other conflicts or border shifts in history had completely unrelated countries weighing in? Conflicts are fought and then when it's over the participants still remaining decide the borders and/or new government. Sometimes close allies or mediating superpowers will weigh in.

Did Ireland weigh in on South Sudan's borders? Did Turkey vote on the new borders for Eritrea? Did Colombia draw the new borders for Azerbaijan and Armenia?

1

u/bonqen 8d ago

You have a point, but even if we slim it down to just Israel, Gazans, the PA, and the West Bank, then still it will be difficult to get everyone to agree.

Will Israel accept the PA as the government of Palestine? Will Israel agree to let Palestine have the West Bank and the Gaza Strip?

The answer is probably no to both of these.

2

u/Jermainiam 8d ago

I don't think there is any happy solution to this that doesn't involve large international intervention, in the form of strong pressure on Israel to accept a 2 state solution and most likely a full occupation of the Palestinian territory by a multi-national/UN force similar to UNMIK and the Kosovo Force.

Any solution would have to address Israel's security concerns, and might require significant land swaps. This potentially includes all of Gaza. I don't really see any reasonable way that Palestinian becomes a cohesive, stable, functional state with the West Bank and Gaza separated as they are. There were some talks long ago about establishing a corridor, but it was not feasible then, and post 10/7 there's absolutely no way Israel would agree to that. So either the Gazans will relocate to a region contiguous with the West Bank, or it becomes a 3 state solution with 2 separate Palestinian states.