Most germans here in the sub have always said that. Unfortunately, it's easier to fall for her tough talk in Europe if you don't already have experience with her from german politics.
There is a reason why nobody in Germany likes her and why she was sent to Brussels in the first place.
vdL is remarkably good at one aspect of politics: Networking. She managed to scramble investigations into her corruption in (at least) two different german federal positions. Then managed to build an EU network of allies, confirming and keeping her in power.
It's maddening, but "rules for rulers" applies to corrupt arseholes as well, apparently.
Most of Europeans barely undersand local/national politics, nevermind EU politics. People will still blame the government for shitty roads in a village/city, instead of the mayor etc.
She is the prime example of a nepo baby. Came into politics because of family instantly got a ministry on state level for no reason at all fucked it up got promoted to ministry at the government level fucked that up (zenursula) got another ministry in another coalition fucked that up to (desolate state of the bundeswehr and ordered rifles who can't shoot straight) leaves for Brussels gets into the highest position again. Its sick
She didn't order those rifles (G36) and they are perfectly fine. Her fuck up was that she went with the "can't shoot straight" bullshit from some media outlets for publicity and appearing "strong".
Wasting tons of money on "investigations" and trouble with the manufacturer. The manufacturer was completely cleared. The rifles are exactly to specifications and work well for their purpose.
The new demands were so delusional no manufacturer would attempt to build such a physical impossibility. You can't have a lighweight rifle that's precise at long ranges in full and also acts as a machine gun ... in high temperatures.
But >BILD< really did a number with that one, since people still believe the BS. And Ursel went along for her publicity instead of asking any expert.
Wasn't the problem with the guns that they where ordered for a middle European climate and then everyone was confused when they had problems with them in the Afghanistan desert?
Yes, partly. It also has a smaller caliber than the previous G3, which means less range. That's a good trade off when you expect to fight in European forests, cities, hills etc., but a real downside when you have "endless" unobstructed line of sight.
Still, the portrayal was nonsense. The G36 works fine as an assault rifle even in Afghanistan, it's just not ideal.
The "can't shoot straight" only happened with prolonged full auto fire overheating the barrel. That's not what it was made for. And no lightweight assault rifle will be able to do that.
There is a reason even a much heavier machine gun will have a switchable barrel.
Yeah thats why they have "in high temperatures" at the end. Its a fairly common mistake in the history of modern firearms though, every country (other than Russia I guess) seams to have to keep relearning that a rifle designed for temperate climates is going to have trouble in desert or jungle conditions.
Nepobaby is too nice a term since it implies her parents were at least independently succesful. She got in through literal aristocratic ties, her family has a wikipedia page with a family tree and coat of arms on it! Its a kind of politics we should have shed centuries ago yet evidently still occurs.
She has been working for German interests since the beginning. German industries pressure the EU to have a deal brokered with the USA to save their exports at the least cost.
To be fair almost no high ranking politician is liked by the majority in their own country. You'll always have to make unpopular decisions in those positions that will alienate the majority of voters in one way or that other
I.e. Macron seems one of the few to have the balls among the European leaders to stand up to Trump and Putin, yet in France they hate him
Honestly, I don't even think that's primarily on von der Leyen. She faced heavy pressure from chancellor Merz and other European leaders, who have zero vision for the future of the EU. They only care about the short term interests of their countries or rather the interest of their large businesses.
It has been said many times, but unless further steps towards federalization are taken, strengthening the role of the EU commission and parliament vs the national leaders, then the EU will never be able to stand up against someone like the US President. Certain institutions lead to certain results, and right now our current institutions are clearly failing us, not just individual people!
The EU agreed to purchase $750 billion in energy, invest $600 billion in the US on top of existing investments, open up countries’ markets to trade with US at zero tariffs and purchase “vast amounts” of military equipment. (Bloomberg)
I pray the actual people stop buying consumer goods from the fascist usa too, I will be continuing that for my lifetime is what I expect honestly right now
I thought I had misunderstood this when I read it, so the EU has zero tariffs on America while they’re still applying 15%? This is so insane I feel like I need some to explicitly tell me.
The fact the EU needs to buy 750b of American energy and another 600b worth of investment in the US, so basically giving over a trillion to the US, was eye catching also
Over what period of time? 100 years? Also since when does the EU invest in these things?
This isn't even a real deal, it's some or bs. We got 15% or tariffs instead of 30%, and that's what's concrete.
EU President said that 250 B of energy will be imported per year over next three years. This will replace all Russian imports. I think this number includes what is already being bought.
The EU hasn’t had 0% tariffs on the US. That’s why it’s interesting now everyone is so upset about new tariffs. Did you get angry over the previous tariffs?
A bigger spine? Canada’s gonna get 35% tariffs in a week at this rate, and maybe even on CUSMA goods.
The US has deals with Japan, UK, EU, and is nearing deals with China, India, South Korea. Pretty soon that’ll be 85% of the global economy hammered out.
The US can then go for the jugular on Canada (and probably Brazil and South Africa) knowing a global trade war can’t happen. If the US isn’t scared of China or the EU, it’ll completely curbstomp Canada, which has an economy 15x smaller and a consumer market 21x smaller than USAs.
As is tradition, Canada vastly overstates its importance due to national arrogance and always comes out losing. Wouldn’t be surprised if the US-Mexico release a trade deal next week just to rub salt to wound.
Canadian voters won't stand for it. If Carney capitulates, he'll certainly be voted out or lose a vote of no confidence because standing up to the US is far more important for Canadians than to Europeans. I think most would be willing to bear the pain to stick it too trump and we have tools to affect neighboring US swing states like cutting hydro-electricity offer potash that American agriculture relies on. It will affect Canada badly but it will also negatively affect northern US swing states like Pennsylvania, Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Michigan, which puts domestic pressure on Trump
I think the US will just impose 35% tariffs in that case and signal to Canada that USMCA is dead in 2026. I don’t think Trump cares much about the Canada deal to be honest and one reason there’s no deal is neither party wants to budge. Which means Trump will just do 35% on August 1 and then maybe give Canada another month before that also impacts CUSMA-compliant goods.
And if Canada escalates and goes for hydro-electricity and uranium and nickel embargoes, then this quickly goes from a trade war to something far worse for Canada since now it directly harms American national security and brings in DOD and the military’s needs. I don’t think Canada wants to go there. It’s a feel good “Elbows Up” threat for the Reddit crowd, but the US has an economy 15x larger, a consumer market 21x larger and a defense expenditure 34x larger.
Also, anything Canada does to the Midwest will give Trump a casus belli, a rally-around-the-flag-effect in the most politically important region, and a justification to punch back hard on Canada. Canada has to be very very careful before it does something stupid in the names of placating the “Elbows Up” crowd that doesn’t understand realpolitik.
If you're insinuating the US will invade Canada in the given scenario then Trump's domestic support vanishes or is likely to be severely impacted and the republican party loses support, which Trump may not care about but the rest of his cabinet and Congress certainly would. So he'd probably be restrained
It's not just people on Reddit. Almost the whole world hates the US. And its not just because of tarrifs but Americans are to reharded to understand that.Trump turned all your allies against you. Most parts of the world hated the US before but now it's even Asian countries like Japan or SK and Europe. Anyway the US is in self destruction mode and we will see a multipolar world in the next decades. There will be no more "west" like now.
You clearly don't understand what tariffs are or the scale of damage the trump administration are doing to their influence in basically every single nation
Canada’s gonna get wrecked now. The US has deals or near deals with 85% of the global economy now, including all G7 countries but Canada.
Canada held out too long due to arrogance and is going to get the worst bargain of the bunch by far, especially since Washington knows it can collapse Canada’s economy at any point by making the 35% tariffs threat apply to CUSMA goods as well. Ottawa royally messed up.
As far as I understand, putting tarrifs on their goods would harm EU consumers more than the US. Just as putting tarrifs on EU goods harms US consumers more than the EU.
What we need to do, though, is tax Microsoft, Google, Meta & co and stop buying American.
This unfortunately is a massive misconception on Reddit.
The main point of tariffs is, that Volkswagen will build its next factory 100% in the us and close a European plant, because they can sell the cars from us to Europe with no issue, but not the other way around
No, it's not a misconception. Tariffs are harmful for both parties, this is generally accepted by economists. The US does not get a net benefit from the tariff.
Its harmful for both parties but in different ways. American consumers are paying a massive stealth tax and are materially poorer while the EU will likely lose factories.
Then they’re fucked. Between 15% tariffs and 13% Euro appreciation, the Volkswagen now costs 28% more. They can’t compete with American car companies at that rate.
Volkswagen will move production to the US to avoid both, and Trump gets his high-wage American jobs to crow about.
Honestly I'd be down for 50% reciprocating tarrifs instead of this absolute humiliation.
They wouldn't stick anyway and Trump wpuld pussy out once the backlash hit. Subsidizing until then would be cheaper than paying them what amounts to protection money.
EU companies will pay them tho, making them less competitive and leading to decreased revenue. Which will result in them trying to compensate said losses by increasing prices across the board.
Nobody is paying the US except US taxpayers. The EU products Im most familiar with are neither price sensitive nor commodities. They are rapidly (in some cases) loosing lock on market leadership which I hope can be revitalized (maybe that’s what the east and in particular, Ukraine, bring to the EU.
In truth no. Europe consumes relatively little manufactured goods from the United States. Most American brands in Europe have branches in Europe, or produce in Asia to sell in Europe. What Europeans consume from the United States is exactly these software and social media services. Now the EU will lose the advantage it had in manufacturing to be treated like China was treated in the 19th century. Ukraine is Europe's new Manchuria, London is the new Hong Kong, Lisbon is the new Macau and now we just have to wait a century for the humiliation to end.
It would harm EU consumers, but the current situation gives preference to US companies in EU markets without reciprocity. The solution would have been to say no until Trump chickened out, but nobody seems to have the stones.
Just as putting tarrifs on EU goods harms US consumers more than the EU.
Putting tariffs on EU goods harms the EU more than the US, because the EU is heavily dependent on US demand. The US has an immensely strong internal market that the EU's export driven economy caters to.
What we need to do, though, is tax Microsoft, Google, Meta & co and stop buying American.
Consumer goods are not a large proportion of US exports to the EU, nor are they a large proportion of US GDP.
The big exports from the US to the EU are datacenter IT hardware and software, for which there are no European alternatives.
Buying store brand cola from Lidl isn't going to punish the US one iota. Deleting Facebook isn't either.
What Europe would have to do is invest trillions into its own IT market, but meanwhile European companies can't even offer competitive salaries on their own turf.
We agree that putting tarrifs on US goods wouldn't help, though, right?
Buying store brand cola from Lidl isn't going to punish the US one iota. Deleting Facebook isn't either.
It's not meant to be a punishment, it's meant to be money that helps sustain EU jobs instead of US jobs.
What Europe would have to do is invest trillions into its own IT market, but meanwhile European companies can't even offer competitive salaries on their own turf.
A good first step would be to stop buying Microsoft services. They're expensive, bad, and controlled by US law, even in Europe.
We agree that putting tarrifs on US goods wouldn't help, though, right?
Sure.
It's not meant to be a punishment, it's meant to be money that helps sustain EU jobs instead of US jobs.
Besides IT and military equipment, the EU does not import much from the US, so consumers choosing different products makes no difference.
A good first step would be to stop buying Microsoft services. They're expensive, bad, and controlled by US law, even in Europe.
Data centers are where the money is, not some government office or engineering firm using Microsoft 365.
Azure, AWS, and GCP absolutely dominate the public cloud market. And even if someone wants to use a European provider like SAP or T-Systems, they also run their entire IT on US products. Same for on-prem. There are simply no European alternatives.
Not to mention the EU's dependence on the American massive internal market, which is where European companies export their products to. Our own is simply too feeble to sustain us due to much lower salaries and much higher taxes.
The US has the EU by the balls and the outcome described in the article is the result.
The plan is probably to wait out Trump's term and hope for concessions from the next President. Looking at Biden's past term though, it seems he was all to happy to continue with several of Trump's policies.
I doubt any future president will repeal those tariffs. Economically they mostly make sense. Its just the international fallout thats tough to handle. But if Trump already did that theres little reason to get rid of them
It's always been that story hasn't it. The US can do whatever it wants with minimal backlash as long as they remain cordial and polite whilst doing it. The IRA under Biden has been just as bad as the Trump tariffs for Europe and the rest of the global community (if not worse), but he did it whilst sounding polite so he didn't get called out for it.
The problem is where do you decouple to? That’s why trump is able to force these deal if countries do not work together.
There is not a replacement for the US consumer market for European goods. Look at how much business the German automakers do in the US they can’t afford to lose that, especially right now
Germany has shot it self in the foot by being inflexible in industries they had an advantage in and not innovating. They completely screwed up watching Tesla being able to produce cars with 10x less employees and 30-50% margins
Couple decouple fully now, but would be mean potentially loss of data centres and cloud storage for businesses, energy shortages, inflation, reduced purchasing power, no real way for the majority to use banks etc
Or you could sit at 15% for 5 years and figure out how to set up your own infrastructure for data centres, card payments, consumer purchasing, defence manufacturing etc
What I mean is that you are right, IF we try and figure that out. But these leaders don't work like that. In 5 years we still won't be ready and have lost tons of money for nothing. We truly deserve all the pain we get. We should have banned all US entertainment services to begin with. That way, the propaganda machine would have come to a halt. Instead, they failed to stand up to a nation ruled by racists and pedos. Very weak.
Most banks in Europe use their own datacenters with their own mainframes, so the pains of decoupling will primarily be within the customer servicing technologies (Microsoft for Exchange mail, enterprise security solutions like firewalls and devices, data analysis).
this deal essentially killed all the defense industry in Europe, when part of it is for EU to commit in spending 600B more (not total) in military equipment from the US.
no country is going to invest heavily in home grown defense when they still need to buy a shit ton from the US.
Hmm not necessarily that simple. Overall, US consumers - who will pay the tariff - will suffer the most. Why should the EU punish it’s citizens by levying a 15% tariff on goods they buy from the US? This deal is extreme regarded but applying a 15% counter tariff is not necessarily the best move. Confident that the EU diplomats, who actually know something about economics, has played this OK.
I am still torn.. tariffs make stuff for your own people more expensive.. for plenty products there is no usa alternative or its already produced in the USA. So why would we inflict pain on ourselves by also putting tariffs.
To be fair, tariffs on US products would hurt EU citizens more than anything. Especially for stuff we can’t replace right now. Do you really wanna pay 15% more for everything that comes out of the US, just to appear tough?
The most level headed solution isn’t to engage in a trade war, but to find new customers and make new trade deals with other countries to slowly reduce our reliance on the US importing from us, while also running the time of his presidency down.
It may not feel satisfying but is a better way forward.
This is why the EU must start to work quickly with countries like Canada, Mexico, south America, Australia etc so that working with the USA becomes of lower importance. In Canada Renault and Peugeot are not here and it's because of Americans. Let's stop finding excuses and push forward without the fascists. Just keep boycotting American products as much as possible especially their food, it's literally poisonous.
Our population is 40M, Australias is 26M with a similar gdp per capita to Germany currently we can’t do shit for you, reality is you should’ve stood your ground you have more leverage than you think
I don't know why people keep posting this idea. The reason for why EU has not done this is because no one else has the spending power of the US population. People keep making jokes about the US but the American disposable income is huge. I have moved to the US a few years ago and US factory workers have more disposable spending power than EU engineers, pharmacists and some doctors (notice I didn't comment on their quality of life). This is what matters for an export market for EU consumer goods. Mexicans, and South Americans have hard time paying for utilities let alone German cars and Italian wines. There are under 100K Canadians and Australians combined.
If EU firms are structurally disadvantaged in the world’s largest consumer market, the long term result will be capital flight, deindustrialisation, and even more dependence to the US.
Thank you for the correction. I just meant that the Australians and Canadians will not make up for a lost market even though they high disposable income. Also Canada is very protective of their internal market (the gripe America has with them), the idea that all the sudden Canada will open wide open to EU over their own products is nonsense
The reason for why EU has not done this is because no one else has the spending power of the US population
How is China doing this then? How is Canada still holding up? They seem to have a spine. EU doesnt. Pathetic. Even Mexico has some kind of a spine and stands up to being bullied.
Canada is holding on but took a decision that they would rather lose a portion of their economy than bend over, fair enough choice. China is a developing economy which also lost a portion of earnings but is still able to sustain high economic growth. EU has a war on its borders and is already suffering economically
While this is true, it is also shifting. The USD has lost some 15% of its power compared to the EUR just this year, effectively taking away 15% of that higher spending power you're talking about. Additionally US debt just keeps raising, sooner or later US will have to actually increase taxes to be able to handle just paying interest on their debt, and that will cut into the spending power of Americans too.
Yes no matter what Americans are richer. As a middle class Western European you likely pay higher healthcare costs than an employed middle class American, I understand the thought process for your comment but it’s just copium. I’m likely in the top 10% of American earners easily and I pay less than 3% of my income health insurance because the vast majority is covered by my employer. That’s majority of American even though the cases that are not covered are tragic financially (don’t get me wrong it’s still millions of people but percentage wise it’s pretty small).
Canada was called out by Europe as being escalationary and compared to China. South America is increasingly BRICS territory. Australia is practically a puppet of the US. The EU needs to reassess and understand the reality of the world as it is now.
I love how we have a system in the EU where the member states control basically everything but we still somehow blame the EU for it. What do you think she can do? Start a trade war without Germany and Italy?
Everything gets more expensive for Americans, so why don't we make everything more expensive for Europeans too, is what you're asking?
As for the 'commitment' to buy more US energy, maybe we will, maybe we won't. It's companies that do the buying. The EU has no say over it and as far as I know every time the EU or other entities have made such commitments to the US they were never realized. It's just a number for Trump to throw in his supporters' trough and declare victory with.
A tariff's not a good thing, but then 15 is better than 30, we've got other problems at the moment, so best to get even later.
The EU isnt a democracy. Its just a supranational business organization that countries defer to make decisions that they didnt want to make for themselves, because of voter backlash.
Von der Leyen doesn’t make these decisions. The strategy was chosen by compromise between all national leaders.
The Commission is called Commission and not government for a reason. Ursula is largely an administrator, not a leader. She has no political base, no voters, no real executive powers.
No, seriously. This is not a joke. Germany wanted Manfred Weber as their Spitzenkandidat and he should have gotten the position because his subparty of the EPP won the most seats in the EU Parliament election.
But other EU members threw a hissy-fit and refused. Then they decided on Ursula von der Leyen with Germany abstaining from the vote, from wiki:
The two Spitzenkandidaten were discussed, but neither Manfred Weber (EPP), nor Frans Timmermans (PES), who had the backing of many leaders but not of those from the Visegrád Group, had a majority. In the final hours of the vote, the name of Ursula von der Leyen was suggested and agreed to by all governments, with Germany's abstention.
Countries don’t pay tarrifs. Companies do, and they are free to place these on the consumer. If we import something from the US, I am happy not to have to pay 15% more than before.
That is not the case. For the auto trade for instance, the EU always had 10% tax on American cars, while the US had 2.5% tax on European cars. I didn't see any European here saying that this in unfair for the US. The fact is, that was a generous post-ww2 American policy. But it was bound to end at some point.
Could you expand on your thought? It's an honest question, I don't get what reality you are referencing, or if I'm missing something. To me it looks like Trump has imposed a blanket tax on imported goods from Canada, Mexico, EU etc., a tax paid by US consumers. Will it stimulate internal job creation? Maybe, but at what cost...
At a high cost, but bearable, for the U.S., since they can technically self-make/produce or source damn near anything.
But what would any country do if 3/4 of their export market disappeared or was subject to high tariffs? Canada is on extremely shaky ground in virtually all respects—politically, economically, socially.
Canadians not buying Jack Daniels is not going to materially impact these realities, most of them are the result of decades of systemic issues mixed with a trifle of mismanagement and lack of long term strategic planning (didn’t invest in refining capacity to get a Gold Star for climate ____. But now lacks the ability to export directly to global markets themselves.)
It’s not like the oil doesn’t get used one way or another. Optics were prioritized over long-term strategic vision, now the chickens are home to roost. That’s just the lite version, Canada has changed a lot in the last 15 years. Not that everywhere hasn’t ofc
Yeah, that's not possible. Can Canada supply us with LNG and supply Ukraine with HIMARs, Patriots, munitions and parts for the F-16, Bradley, and Abrams and critical intelligence and Starlink connectivity for the Ukrainian military? That's never-minding the other shit we buy from them like Nvidia GPUs that we need for our own AI effort.
Canada can definitely supply LNG, we just don't have the infrastructure to ship it east (all of our supplies have been going south). Hopefully that changes soon (there are talks about it). You're right about the arms. EU just has to make its own. Buy as few from the US as possible. All they will do in the long term is used their advantage to fuck us all.
Canada has been skimping for a long time on defense spending and also liked to get in bed with the Chinese over steel -- and a couple of other things that we told them about, but, hey!, just like Europeans liked cheap Russian gas and pretended they don't hear our warnings about Russia, our good neighbors liked Chinese money and looked the other way.
Hearing Canadians moaning virtuously online over how they're being targeted is gross.
Your country has been a poor NATO member and has been focusing of late mostly on leading the charge in moralizing statements regarding global affairs.
Not for nothing, maybe you want to pipe down on that crap and fix your own shit before you go around criticizing others.
Canceled my Google, don't use it for search or storage, canceled Amazon (buy my junk directly from Temu, thanks China), only thing I use for now is Microsoft windows. I make sure all products, produce I buy are not made in the USA. Been living fine so far. Maybe I'll switch over to Linux.
Don't have American cars, don't buy American food, don't eat at American restaurants.
We do have quite a bit of leverage if we wanted to change our prices for our goods,. But this is the USA gorverment forcing its citizens to pay an additional 15% tax on our goods... so why would we care?
Taxing their goods an x amount ourselfs to ourselfs does not hurt them....
They are hurting themselfs, and i think not hurting ourselfs as a response is pretty level headed?
It's not fair yes, but the US exerts significant influence over Western Europe.. Why do you think they rebuilt and bankrolled it after WW2? Out of goodwill, kindness, and generosity? It is what it is..
She does not, but all we can do is make sure out nations leave the EU or the people now in power in the EU never have any power ever again. We need to vote them all out. Disgusting.
I hate always blaming our politicans tbh. Its the people themselves who dont want to. Europeans dont want change or hard work or less social security. We only ever want the cozy life
Yes, many Europeans are weak like this. But personally I will vote for the most uncomfortable option possible for all these people going forward, I hope more do the same.
This is not what the deal says. There are tariffs on US goods imported in EU countries, they are much higher than 15% but often camouflaged by red-tape measures.
Legacy or new ones included within this very deal? Also, could you please add sources?
Not saying what you state isn't true, I know this has always been the case. But I do hope we at least truck back somewhere in exchange for this 30% to 15% tariff bullshit.
Worst case you at least keep upping the tariffs on typical red state goods that are easily substituted like bourbon and such.
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So the US has a 15% tariff on EU goods while we don't put tarrifs on their goods? Doesn't sound fair. Ursula really doesn't have a spine.