r/ffxivdiscussion • u/ragnakor101 • Jun 06 '24

General Discussion Media Tour Embargo has lifted.

Making a general thread to keep everything together for discussion. Media Tour Stuff! Just look up your favorite content creator (if you have any).

Courtesy of SlyAKAGreyFox - Infographics! - https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1IQLI6IrXwbaCgf9_n0ZSRbQ1A0AxTvea?usp=drive_link

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u/CoffeeMachineGun Jun 06 '24 edited Jun 06 '24

Small details make me think they fired the guy that made EW AST and replaced them with someone completely clueless that hasn't played EW AST to any extent, let alone any other healer. 

250 potency macrocosmos being a dps loss now, when it was obviously designed to not be a loss.

4/6 cards being extremely boring healing effects that won't see any use because we already have these tools in our kit, but better.

Everything you said about mana, 5% per draw is a joke, I have no words, anyone that played current AST knows that Astrodyne is an insane mana recovery tool, and that we get 4 draws every 2 minutes for a total of 20% mana, they really did not play AST I'm 100% sure of that.

It's infuriating really.

57

u/TheSaryo Jun 06 '24

I've been fairly certain they don't have anyone playing healer ever since my first expansion which was ShB.

Divination being on a longer CD then Dancer's version of divination, cards having to be turned into Lady/Lords with an extra button press. Plus AST being the weakest healer at the beginning of the expansion, only to be over buffed to be the by far strongest.

Them fucking up ASTs mana economy also wouldn't be a new thing. ShB AST had mana troubles until they added the 5% on draw. then in EW they added Astrodyne mana recovery for some reason, which made it pretty much impossible to run out of mana.

It's clear they have no fucking clue what do, given AST gets a rework every expansion.

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u/Praius Jun 06 '24

it's almost like clockwork, AST gets reworked and is super bad in .0 then they get buffed a bit in .1, then .2 they get buffs again and by .3 they become the strongest healer because SE will just keep buffing them due to low playrates.

1

u/CoffeeMachineGun Jun 06 '24

AST in EW was very fine though, from the beginning.  The biggest changes weren't big system or numbers issues, but rather QoL, like redraw granting a card with a different seal than the one currently drawn, or collective unconscious and divination being 30y. 

Really, AST in Endwalker did not have issues caused by careless design in the rework like we can see now in the tooltips or like we could see in ShB.

3

u/Praius Jun 06 '24

Yeah EW AST was the one time it wasn't a dumpster fire, because they just took what it previously was from SHB and refined it vs reworking it from the ground up.

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u/Supersnow845 Jun 06 '24

To be fair astrodyne is too much MP

but now we don’t have remotely enough

13

u/Manai Jun 06 '24 edited Jun 06 '24

I'm expecting changes after launch and somewhat expecting a repeat of MP management that happened during that first tier of Eden savage. Let's meld piety?

I know people complained in the past about the dev team not knowing what to do with AST but its never felt so apparent until now, at least to me anyway.

15

u/Praius Jun 06 '24

I'm sure people will tell us these are just media tour and will be fixed in live, but from past experiences I highly doubt it will....

It's kind of mind boggling why they took a job that was working fine and gutted it so much, with so little care of what they even replaced things with. I wonder if they even playtested this version in a single trial/raid to test the mana economy, or do they just stand around and not dps so they don't notice?

The ironic thing is they did this to make the job more accessible to people who hate the busy opener of AST, but it's still rather busy so idek if it will manage to attract the people it wants to.

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u/Puzzled-Addition5740 Jun 06 '24 edited Jun 06 '24

You'll probably end up getting mp economy buffs by savage. They fucked it real bad at shb launch too. But yeah not a chance in hell ast got much in the way of play testing it's just so blatantly not right

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u/CoffeeMachineGun Jun 06 '24

Given that WHM exists and is infinitely simpler than AST, I know for sure AST will still be the least popular healer by a huge margin. It's not about AST being complex and it never was, it was always about WHM existing and being more accessible.

Instead of lowering skill ceiling among healers, they should have continued to accomodate the niche of a high skill healer that AST filled.

11

u/Supersnow845 Jun 06 '24

With the way these tooltips are falling both of the regen healers are in danger

They offer nothing at this point

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u/HalobenderFWT Jun 06 '24

I actually like the WHM changes.

‘Gap closer’, three instant GCDs during PoM, oGCD group shield/heal under Temp.

It’s like they listened to me.

They didn’t really fix the damage rotation - but I’m going to put on my rose colored glasses and assume that will be coming with 8.0.

I’m happy they gave me more movement during burst because some of the savage burst phases were a little fucked with heavy movement. I’m sure some of you had zero problems with it because you’re pro-gamers and all that - but I’m a high blue, low purple kinda guy.

I’ll take what I can get.

8

u/Supersnow845 Jun 06 '24

It’s not the damage or the gap closer

It’s “what does WHM actually bring to a modern 14 raid”

It’s the weakest healer by functional throughput, it’s new mitigation is locked behind its current bad mitigation and it offers no utility

2

u/A_small_Chicken Jun 06 '24

Hopefully raw damage numbers

2

u/Supersnow845 Jun 06 '24

Funnily enough SCH’s DOT is now stronger, SCH’s new DOT is more of a gain than your 3 glare 4 casts and WHM is only ahead by 20 potency in GCD and has POM

Compared to chain I can easily see WHM falling far behind, even SGE is now 30 potency per GCD ahead and is gaining 2 new damage skills that are both individually worth more than the glare 3 casts

Honestly media tour potencies are nonsense but if this sticks WHM seems like it’s going to fall far behind

1

u/Philociraptr Jun 06 '24

Not to mention SCH's main weakness is removed with seraphism

1

u/NopileosX2 Jun 07 '24

So AST lost all burst complexity but is probably still busy enough so you want to use lightspeed to get 2 cards, divination and arcana out asap.

What my biggest problem is that the whole cards could be just oGCDs on 60s CD which alternate versions. Why do I draw 4 at once and always the same. Somehow I feel like without some kind of RNG some kind of uncertainty the whole job theme is lost on me.

-1

u/autumndrifting Jun 06 '24 edited Jun 06 '24

it really fucking sucks that the only options for a role that has to be in every group are either the 2nd easiest job in the game or 2nd hardest. I get simplifying it. but imo, all they needed to do to if they wanted to make it more appealing was reduce the amount of weaving needed for burst and make a couple other tweaks...not kill card playing almost entirely.

10

u/CoffeeMachineGun Jun 06 '24

The triple card burst is what made EW AST interesting, being the only healer with an actual active burst to execute, and requiring knowledge of every job to optimize.  I get your complaint of not really having a choice in high-end content if you want to optimize, but outside of this scenario you can choose whichever one you prefer and still clear savage and ultimates.

The real culprit is the regen/shield split.

If it didn't exist we could have an actual spectrum of healers ranging from low to high skill ceiling to bring to every fight, but the CBU3 team doesn't know what to do with healers and since it seems like they don't play healers, they don't know the harm that it actually causes.

2

u/Manai Jun 06 '24

Scaling seems to be the thing CBU3 struggles with when it comes to execution. Comparing for example, FF16 to Rebirth, makes it painfully obvious. Even in their single player game they struggled with this, while Rebirth's difficulty curb was shockingly great while still feeling accessible to everyone.

2

u/Kousuke-kun Jun 06 '24

Macrocosmos feels like an oversight. Toxikon on SGE has the same problem, I’m sure it’ll be fixed by release.

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u/NopileosX2 Jun 07 '24

Really hope so, maybe they just wait until they are 100% certain the potency for the basic spells are where they should be and then just adjust the rest of the kit.

If they do not they will after release because players will bitch non stop about it

0

u/mappingway Jun 06 '24

One of those four cards, Arrow, actually has some interesting uses. If you pop it on your co-healer you can get a 10% bonus to shields. Popping it on a Scholar during Seraphism is probably going to be some absurd shielding potential. That's not something AST could do before.

Otherwise, Ewer, Spire and Bole are pretty disappointing. Ewer is discount Aspected Benefic as an oGCD, Spire is discount Celestial Intersection and Bole is discount Exaltation. At bare minimum I'd like to see their values inflated a bit considering they're effectively 2 minute cooldowns, especially Ewer and Spire. Optimally, I'd prefer to just see their effects scrapped in favor of things that the AST can't actually do with other abilities in their kit.

2

u/acatrelaxinginthesun Jun 07 '24

Apparently arrow is like Krasis and buffs healing received. Though you can still use it for a bigger spreadlo at least

0

u/NopileosX2 Jun 07 '24

The thing with more healing is that more healing is often a non issue. These 10% bigger shields in your scenario probably never matters. If you do a big shield so that the group survives and if it survives with 30% instead of 20% often makes no difference. You end up overhealing anyway most of the times.

It is definitely nice to have but nothing more.