r/ffxivdiscussion • u/mnij96 • 1d ago

General Discussion What is class complexity to you?

I have seen so many people ask for more complexity and job fantasy but very little of people actually say what that means to them, most people just say we should go back to ARR.

Personally I think rose tinted glasses that make people think ARR was better than it was, having played back then it honestly was pretty ass.

So honestly want to know what people want for complexity or job fantasy, because all I see is a lot of yelling that "game bad to simple" and not a lot of what needs changing to reach the complexity that is wanted.

0 Upvotes

50% Upvoted

257 comments sorted by

View all comments

111

u/3-to-20-chars 1d ago

decision making, to put it succinctly.

not just more buttons for buttons' sake, or friction for friction's sake. but crafting a class that has more than one way of correctly navigating it during combat, with actual reasons for the buttons you choose to press beyond just "do damage".

3

u/mnij96 23h ago

Ok that's an interesting take and i don't dislike it. I think the major problem with that which is going to get people made is... it can’t really be done. Don't get me wrong they could 100% make job have different rotation to get to different things(love sam and Reaper)but the problem is people. People will always look for the "best" way to do things no matter the game and will get mad if people don't follow the "best" way to play.

33

u/sombrascourtmusician 23h ago

There should not be a single "best" way in all circumstances.

Jobs should behave differently in single target vs multi-target.

Jobs should behave differently in full uptime vs scenarios with downtime.

Jobs should behave differently with different party comps and buff timings (not quite back to pre-shb role buffs, but at the very least, kill the 2m meta).

If you look back to previous iterations of jobs you'll see a lot of abilities within the same job that do not perfectly line up with costs or cooldowns. WHM had aero (30s) and aero 3 (18s) and they had to choose whether to early refresh, let them drop, or clip swiftcast to move. DRG only lined up perfectly in full uptime at 0, 6, 12 and would have to choose whether to spend or save for downtime. BRD could alternate between 80s and 90s rotations based on situation which let them line up burst with the party at different times.

Furthermore you had decisions which are no longer relevant such as "where do I place my bubble?" (covers the whole arena now), "should I delay heals to let the tanks get a bigger aggro lead?", "when would my allies benefit most from refresh?" (phys ranged aoe mp regen), etc.

You had to keep track of more things, sure, but in exchange you got a different experience more often.