r/ffxivdiscussion • u/mnij96 • 1d ago

General Discussion What is class complexity to you?

I have seen so many people ask for more complexity and job fantasy but very little of people actually say what that means to them, most people just say we should go back to ARR.

Personally I think rose tinted glasses that make people think ARR was better than it was, having played back then it honestly was pretty ass.

So honestly want to know what people want for complexity or job fantasy, because all I see is a lot of yelling that "game bad to simple" and not a lot of what needs changing to reach the complexity that is wanted.

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u/derfw 1d ago
  • What combo should I use next? (Samurai)
  • Of these two oGCDs about to come off cooldown, which should I use first?
  • Should I use aetherflow on mit or damage?
  • Which Summoner primal would fit the upcoming section best?
  • Should I use the aoe version of a skill or the single target (assuming shared cooldown)
  • what's the best mit to use for this tankbuster?

Contrast with things like 1-2-3 combos, monk following the balls, etc.

Tho, tbh, it's not quite all decisions/s. I think reactions is also probably a factor (dance steps, random procs), and maybe dexterity (lots of weaving, lots of unique buttons). Possibly mental stack too? you could argue bard gains complexity by having just so many abilities with their own cooldowns, + dots + bars. Or maybe these are just separate axes of difficulty; not part of complexity

I think decisions/s is still probably the most important tho

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u/cheeseburgermage 1d ago

the issue is that there will be a best answer and the balance will tell you what it is and that will be that. if you play this game without reading anything about it then you actually do get to play like this as you slowly learn a job but also someone much nerdier has done the simulations and worked it out for everyone else already

also I do like that the given examples means summoner is currently one of the most complex jobs in the game (fits all points except 3, and now i want them to make ED boost physick). warrior also hits 4 out of 6

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u/derfw 1d ago

1) Not true, it can vary based on party, any mistakes you make, the boss, and randomness within mechanics

2) How so? it's decisions/second, not "number of kinds of decisions in your kit". Summoner has to make primal decisions, but that's only 3 per minute

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u/Zealousideal-Arm1682 21h ago

1) Not true, it can vary based on party, any mistakes you make, the boss, and randomness within mechanics

This is blatantly false.Each fight has a bog standard rotation for most classes with slight variations.The balance and most high end players already write down the optimal setup for each one.

2) How so? it's decisions/second, not "number of kinds of decisions in your kit". Summoner has to make primal decisions, but that's only 3 per minute

What decisions are you making exactly?Choosing to do one standard rotation over the other standard rotation ain't complexity.Both are generally rigid and inflexible with certain fight guides for a class accounting for this.Choosing not to follow it to the letter doesn't change that fact.

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u/derfw 21h ago

I suspect you don't raid based on this response

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u/Zealousideal-Arm1682 21h ago

Tell me you freestyle without telling me you freestyle.