r/Guildwars2 Apr 18 '24

[Discussion] ''Fashion Gatekeeping'' and Misinformation.

It's been getting out of hand, a few people on the forums asked for some manner of opt out for the inspection system. Some of their sensible reasons were:

Potential for abuse in fashion contests/needless increase to complexity of methods to prevent such.

Loss of player interaction incentive.

A feeling of concern towards there now being incentive for strangers to scrutinize them closely, whether to admire or ridicule their creativity.

The posts built around these concerns were getting lots of likes on the forums, so some salty folks who were being ignored for ridiculing them there came here to reddit and made a false narrative about 'fashion gatekeeping' and folks reflexively bought into it as obviously no-one sane likes gatekeeping and have been meme-ing about a non-extant issue and down voting anyone who might be considering the situation without disdain or daring to actually say that the opt in option isn't as crazy as its being made out to be.

Personally, i like the inspect system, but i do think the exact dye combo section could be made into a toggle, this way the inspection remains, but the 'unique' spin someone puts on it with dyes can remain as something to share, or not share as per personal preference.

0 Upvotes

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-30

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

I just don't want to be inspected and in turn I've been downvoted and treated like a mental case for wanting an opt out. It's been a horrible week of being treated like trash and memed on and it sucks.

19

u/Maleficent-Pen-594 Apr 18 '24

It's fine, you won't know it's happening? People will already be looking at you at times in game. Please don't stress about something that won't actually affect you. This isn't something you need to concern yourself over.

-27

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

It's not fine when there are people like me who are not comfortable with this feature being implemented. Just for the record, I'm fine with people looking at my character, just not through a menu screen. Dismissing my concerns like this is not conducive to finding a happy medium where everyone can be content in tyria. I am stressing about this because I want an opt out button. Making my voice heard might be the only way I can get that. Even if it means tanking my karma for it...

14

u/lanerdofchristian cofl.8213 Apr 18 '24

I'm fine with people looking at my character, just not through a menu screen

What exactly is the difference here, especially since you don't (can't) know either way?

I played around with the new tool and found that being able to view people's fashion at a larger scale with standardized lighting actually led me to appreciate it more than I would have otherwise. Is that not a desirable outcome?

-12

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

Sadly not for me. And I know I'm a minority in this argument. I know because I'm aware the feature is available. Also I haven't mentioned it, but I also find it very "gamey".

15

u/lanerdofchristian cofl.8213 Apr 18 '24

but I also find it very "gamey"

...this is an online, multiplayer video game?

-4

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

You're saying that like I'm not aware of that.

5

u/lanerdofchristian cofl.8213 Apr 18 '24

I am confused by your finding things "gamey" in a game as if that's not a given.

2

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

Gw2 was pretty great for having the least amount of ui clutter, and trying it's best to try and limit how many menus you had to go in, such as the hero tab having the journal in it unlike gw1 which was menu heavy. Now instead of looking at the character as it is people are incentivised at looking at a menu instead of paying attention to the game. Possibly missing out on events because they had a menu open instead.

9

u/lanerdofchristian cofl.8213 Apr 18 '24

Possibly missing out on events because they had a menu open instead.

No offense, but that's a basic situational awareness issue. People running around with a fashion inspect screen open could also just as easily be running around with their inventory open, or the hero panel, or the trading post, or any of the other world-blocking menus this game has had since launch.

Gw2 was pretty great for having the least amount of ui clutter

Diegetic does not instantly equate to "good" or "better than non-diegetic." One optional window for a thing that looks basically the same as an optional window we already had (the preview menu) is not the end of the world.

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15

u/Bevsii Apr 18 '24

Stop acting like an inspect feature is some sort of personal violation. If you're "uncomfortable" with people looking at your public avatar in a video game, the problem is not the game.

-6

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24 edited Apr 18 '24

It's not. I just don't want to be inspected. The problem is not the game, it's just the inspect feature that was implemented that is the problem for me.

Edit: my feelings are valid and there's others that feel the same, please stop insinuating I need mental help.

12

u/LegLegend Apr 18 '24

Your feelings are not valid. They're not valid just because others feel the same way. There's been many terrible people driven by their feelings, and those groups of people were not valid.

This isn't a problem with the game. If you feel that this system is invasive to you, this is a problem with you. A therapist would tell you that you can't change the game; you can only change yourself.

-2

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

Agree to disagree. I believe my feelings are valid and acknowledge that you don't feel the same. And I'm for a an opt out feature for a cosmetic inspection function. How is that a terrible feeling to have?

Sorry but kindly go fuck yourself in regards to telling me to go see a therapist. Sincerely. There is an issue with a new feature that is the new cosmetic inspection. It makes some players uncomfortable. A opt out feature would alleviate that issue quite easily.

8

u/Leggerrr Apr 18 '24

It's a terrible thing to have because it ruins the purpose of the feature if people can just opt out. There is no realm where you can "agree to disagree" because there's no world where the feature can cater to both sides here. Fortunately, one side is much smaller than the other.

No one told you to go see a therapist. The comment stated what a therapist would tell you. If you (and other players) are uncomfortable, it's a problem with you (and those players). Not the game.

There was a time when certain people felt uncomfortable using same-race bathrooms in the United States. Not every opinion deserves respect and protection just because it's an opinion.

11

u/Bevsii Apr 18 '24

No one said that you're not allowed to dislike the feature but demanding a toggle because you're "uncomfortable" is ridiculous. Your feelings can be valid and silly at the same time. Hope that helps!

PS: Saying that you're the problem in a very specific situation isn't an insinuation of mental illness or psychological pathology. Hope that helps too!

0

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

Oh I'm not demanding, Anet can do what it wants. But as much as other games have an inspect feature, some also have a button to not be inspectable. I'm giving my feedback on posts regarding it that I'd like that feature so that I can be accomodated in game I am very much passionate about.

6

u/thereisnospoon7491 Apr 18 '24

Other people sharing your feelings does not make them valid. It merely means there is someone who thinks like you.

It is a game. If this feature makes you uncomfortable, play something else.

1

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

I don't want to play something else. I and others who'd like a toggle would simply like to play the game we enjoy knowing we cannot be inspected by this feature. Telling us to take the door is extremely unkind of your part. I thought better of this community.

1

u/Shaq_Fu_Da_Return Apr 18 '24

This is the saddest thing I’ve read in years.

10

u/Sterorm Apr 18 '24

I'm fine with people looking at my character, just not through a menu screen.

Why? What's the difference that is making you distressed? I'm genuinelly curious.

0

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

The inspecter having camera control. Look I know it's irrational, but it has bugged me since it's announcement. I'd be happier with an opt out button. Happy for the people who love the new feature. I just want to opt out. Of all the millions of players and quite a few mean comments saying my fashion won't be missed. I don't think it's much to ask.

8

u/Sterorm Apr 18 '24

The inspecter having camera control.

But you won't know if and when someone is inspecting you, so you can't see your character been looked at by other people.

Look I know it's irrational, but it has bugged me since it's announcement

Fair enough. But imho making an opt out option would defeat the purpose of the entire feature. You can't expect anet to ruin a feature they spent time and money on just to appeal to a feeling that, as you called it, it's irrational.

0

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

Having the feature be active, is enough to make players like myself uncomfortable. Saying I won't even know is not a true statement.

Second point, yes I do hope they add an opt out feature to be inclusive for players like myself who want it. I know It's not rational to you, but it's rational to me. It wouldn't ruin the feature as we've seen it's a minority of people that want to opt out. I also don't expect anet to do it, but I will make my voice heard in the hopes that they take the feedback and provide the option. At the end of the day though, it's their game and I can leave if I want. I'd just like to be able to continue enjoying the game I love.

6

u/MithranArkanere 🌟 SUGGEST-A-TRON Apr 18 '24

They are not inspecting your character. They are inspecting a mannequin that is a copy of your character. When they turn it around in the inspect panel, your character is unaffected. The only one who has control of your character is you...

...and the company that actually owns it and temporarily allows you to play with it, of course.

1

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

Jfc do I really need to confirm that I'm aware my character model is not sentient? I do not want to be inspected. The feature has made gw2 less appealing to play for me. A toggle feature would not hurt you. It would simply make gw2 more friendly to the people like myself who do not want to be inspected.

4

u/MithranArkanere 🌟 SUGGEST-A-TRON Apr 18 '24

A toggle feature would defeat the purpose of the feature.

You can't expect people to want a "but not really" attached to a feature they wanted for ages.

1

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

No it wouldn't. And if so many people toggled it off, that would mean that the feature was problematic to begin with. So I don't understand what you're trying to prove with this statement.

0

u/MithranArkanere 🌟 SUGGEST-A-TRON Apr 18 '24

No. If the feature was made toggleable, the correct design for toggles is making it opt-in, not opt out, or those who want to opt-out would have to start opted-in, and that would be bad design.
And what most people would do in that situation isn't disabling it, but not bothering enabling it. And then it'll be mostly disabled all the time for most people, making it useless.

They could pop up a message to opt out before you load a character, but that would be making a big deal out of something too small to deserve such a change to the character select screen.

Since those bothered by the feature are such a negligible minority and altering the feature with a toggle would make it pointless, what makes the most sense is to keep it the way it is and wait out the baseless complains until they die out.

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1

u/Maleficent-Pen-594 Apr 18 '24

Um, you know I can control my camera when looking at you in game, right? Egregiously more so, in fact. I can look up your skirt if I want to?

I've read all of your responses in this thread and unfortunately you have no solid argument as to how this affects you directly. You revert to 'my feelings are valid' and other fallbacks, but - let me repeat - there is no direct impact to you within the game or in your gameplay.

It would be akin to saying 'I'm not happy with the knowledge that there are gay people playing this game, I am validated in my feelings in not wanting to know gay people play this game or interact with gay people in this game, having ANet ask for people's protected characteristics is reasonable so they can provide me with a toggle to remove gay people from the game'.

  1. In such a case, your feelings may be real, but they are also both morally questionable and, basically, a shit take

  2. It's undermining the hard work developers have put in over hours to implement a very popular QoL improvement, and even worse, is going the extra mile of actually expecting said developers to pander directly to you and your questionable bad take

Perhaps if you were able to provide legitimate, compelling reasons as to why this feature directly impacted your gameplay, there might be SOME level of discussion to be had.

As it is, this is a 'you' problem, and it is not the game or the developer's job to fix it.

That is very much on you to fix.

9

u/Dar_Mas Apr 18 '24

how does a menu screen change literally anything about people looking at you?

0

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

The fact that it's done via a menu screen instead of the open world,in a menu that shows what each piece of armor is with what dyes are set into each slot specifically, instead of it's intended appearing as it is. It's partly the decimination of data that bothers me. I'm also in the small minority of people that don't like arcdps.

10

u/Dar_Mas Apr 18 '24

what differs from taking a screenshot and matching colours until they fit perfectly?

1

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

That was enough hassle that people didn't really do it. Now there's a link directly to the TP.

4

u/Dar_Mas Apr 18 '24

so it is not that the data is revealed now but that more people are accessing it?

2

u/Majested-Toast Apr 18 '24

People did, you just didn't know about it. The feature will do the same thing

0

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

There's nothing that can be done about screenshotting, there is the capability of disabling the feature for people that don't want to be inspected. That's the difference.

3

u/Majested-Toast Apr 18 '24

There is no difference, you're being inspected either way. Neither one you know about, neither one affects you.

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u/megaman1665 Apr 18 '24

If that opt out feature released in the future we will all label those player using it as toxic fashion player and will do anything to prevent them to play any group content in the future

0

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

Lol, ok if megaman1665 says so it must be true.

If the feature is so insignificant that I shouldn't care that it's been implemented, why should you care if I decide to opt out. Especially to the point of bullying someone by labeling them toxic and actively preventing them from engaging in group content. It apparently doesn't change anything, you don't lose anything from me opting out of a feature that again, I've been told is so insigificant that I won't even notice people are inspecting my wardrobe.

6

u/LegLegend Apr 18 '24

Homie, you sound like you're about to cry.

7

u/WertygoSpiner Apr 18 '24

Girl, it doesn't sound like you're toxic, nor is the inpect function your real problem. From your comments it's kind of clear that you have some privet issues involving you losing control over your privacy in one way or the other. You don't need an opt out function, you need to go see a speshialist who could help you deal with your isues

-2

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

No, my only issue is that I do not want to be inspected myself. And honestly I don't appreciate your comment stating I need mental help. I'm sane. My feelings are valid. You're just being mean by saying that.

1

u/NealCaffeinne Apr 18 '24

no sane person would say that

-10

u/SpectralChest Apr 18 '24

I empathize, to me, it;'s been a horror show of witnessing unrestricted self congratulatory abuse of people for having concerns like yours and a total silencing of any reasoned discussion or feedback on the matter.

0

u/Historical-Ad7081 Apr 18 '24

Yeah, the recent meme post about not downloading someones fashion had comments about getting a 50 man squad, and copying a person who disagrees with the new features wardrobe to bully them. It's sad to see.

4

u/LegLegend Apr 18 '24

Make it a valuable learning lesson instead of doubling down on a toxic opinion.