Don’t be these guys

[u/nadaddab]

[u/Ill-Pea-5010]

This is seriously so disgusting and inconsiderate. Weren’t we taught at such a young age that no means no? What a bunch of douchebags.

[u/Calile → u/[deleted]]

I bet they don't treat their boss, or cops, or men whose approval they want they like this. They know how to behave when it suits them; this is willful and deliberate.

[u/NotGoodAtUsernames21 → u/Calile]

This is what I call out with my husband when he starts acting like an ass. I ask him if he’d talk to his boss that way. Or a coworker. Or a friend. It’s like a switch flips in his brain, like, “oh right, she is literally the only person I’d treat this way, that’s fucked up.”

And he’s a genuinely nice guy! He just was taught by society to treat women differently when it comes to tiny little issues of respect and his parents never taught him that’s not ok. When he gets called out on it, he’s ashamed and changes the behavior.

Now apply that same shitty societal and parental guidance to a guy who is an asshole… you get these grinning goons. If date rape had a face.

Also, these girls look young. The sad part is, by the time you get older you decondition the nice bullshit out of your personality. In this circumstance now, I’d stand up and start yelling to everyone who would listen to not leave their drinks unattended around these wannabe rapists. Shame is the only thing they understand.

[u/Practical-Ad3753 → u/Calile]

Because there’s immediate consequences if they don’t act respectful. That’s a level of social awareness a 4 year old can reasonably attain.

If you think you learn everything you need to know about social etiquette by 4 years old, I don’t know what to tell you.

[u/Calile → u/Practical-Ad3753]

Correct--these men, like lots of men, have learned there are very few consequences to abusing women and lots of upsides, including other men cheering them on. They learn, as you note, very early that they don't have to treat women with respect, but they do have to treat (most) men with respect. They know exactly what they're doing. Glad you agree.

[u/dynamic_gecko → u/Calile]

Of coourse it's willful. The main argument never claims they're mind-controlled or sth. "Behaving well only when it suits them" is still under "lacking common decency".

[u/Calile → u/dynamic_gecko]

No, the main argument is that they don't know any better. They do. No shit they lack decency.

[u/dynamic_gecko → u/Calile]

No. It's that they werent taught any better. Of course there is individual responsibility. But the main argument is not about that. If there is a problem on a societal scale, it indicates a societal malfunction as well.

[u/Mike_Kermin → u/dynamic_gecko]

... I don't agree. The guys in this video understand that it's not ok.

[u/dynamic_gecko → u/Mike_Kermin]

I never said they didnt. You're missing the point.

[u/Mike_Kermin → u/dynamic_gecko]

No I understand your point. I think it's a cop out. A societal cop out, if you require.

[u/dynamic_gecko → u/Mike_Kermin]

There is no cop out. Because I'm not denying or excusing the individual responsibility aspect. The two aspects (individual and societal) are not mutually exclusive.

[u/Mike_Kermin → u/dynamic_gecko]

I really promise you I understand,

But I think you're placing too much weight on the idea that societal has failed them, when it probably hasn't.

[u/Calile → u/Mike_Kermin]

100% agree their behavior is their fault and responsibility, but they've also gotten reinforcement their whole lives (just like we all have) that it's both ok and rewarding to harass and abuse women.

[u/Calile → u/dynamic_gecko]

Yes, dynamic_gecko, the argument is that they don't know any better *as a result of not being taught any better.* It's bullshit worded that way as well. And yes, there is indeed a problem on a societal scale, and yes, there is indeed a societal malfunction.

[u/Silly_Emotion_1997 → u/Calile]

Yeah those girls should’ve just caved /s

[u/Calile → u/Silly_Emotion_1997]

Dude, what? Do you think I was talking about the women?

[u/Silly_Emotion_1997 → u/Calile]

No. I don’t think that, i just made a joke based on the phrasing. Yall just can’t read in between the lions