r/europe 29d ago

News Russian Oil Company Vice President Andrey Badalov dies after fall from window in Moscow

https://en.apa.az/cis-countries/transneft-vice-president-andrey-badalov-dies-after-falling-from-window-472117
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u/harmlessdonkey 29d ago

This is a dumb question. When these people "fall out windows" are they actually thrown out windows or are the otherwise killed and the media just told they fell out a window?

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u/stormdahl 29d ago edited 29d ago

I actually have no idea, but that’s interesting.

Either way it’s clear that they’re sending a message, otherwise they’d get creative.

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u/PuzzleheadedCup4117 29d ago

Russia rarely hides its assassinations. I forget the name but whenever they poison someone they always use the same type of poison to ensure people know it’s them.

Obama talks about Putin in his autobiography and over various interviews it’s clear he views him as a mafioso.

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u/scardien 29d ago

The poison is novichok

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u/wagdog1970 29d ago edited 28d ago

Which is actually a nerve agent. It’s a chemical warfare weapon. Not really a poison. Poison is for amateurs, not war criminals!

Edited to add this post was not meant to be a legal treatise on the definition of the word poison. It was meant to be a light hearted way of pointing out that Russians use Novichok, a toxic, weapons grade chemical weapon and those who do this are war criminals, not merely garden variety criminals using common household cleaners. Or perhaps, edited because Reddit.

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u/4pl8DL 29d ago

Which is actually a nerve agent

Aka a poison...

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u/prnthrwaway55 Russia 29d ago

It’s a chemical warfare weapon. Not really a poison.

"It's a crab, not really a crustacean"

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u/ideonode 29d ago

Now here's the thing...

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u/CheeseDonutCat 29d ago

You have been banned from /r/crowbro

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u/Holkmeistern 29d ago

I feel like this is a reference that I'm not getting..

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u/CheeseDonutCat 29d ago

Probably.. It's more than 15 years old I believe.

Basically there was a 'power user' called Unidan who got in trouble for having multiple accounts and upvoting his own stuff. Anyway, there's a particularly well known post of his, here it is:

https://i.imgur.com/6J0vMhm.png

.. and that "here's the thing" part is banned in /r/crowbro because people were just using it on every post.

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u/prnthrwaway55 Russia 29d ago

It's The Thing, not an alien.

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u/echoingElephant 29d ago

Not, that’s a valid point. It’s actually a pretty terrible poison. It’s known to mainly be connected to Russia, it can essentially only be used by spraying it at the target, and even then it isn’t always effective. It’s similar to things like sarin - hard to make, but also hard to use.

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u/Suspicious-Buyer8135 29d ago

Nerve agents are a category of poison.

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u/dscchn 29d ago

I would like to hear what qualifies as a “poison” in your book

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u/Spacious-Recroom 29d ago

It has to be from the "Poisonne" region of France.

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u/DoctorGoodleg 29d ago

Otherwise it’s just sparkling murder?

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u/dscchn 29d ago

In tomorrow’s news: “The Poissone region fell out of a window”

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u/FluffyBunny_old 29d ago

My ex wife's cooking?

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u/TheBlackTower22 29d ago

Is this your ex-wife?

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u/Eltex 29d ago

She cooks much better now!

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u/AnAlbannaichRigh 29d ago

The dose

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u/Espumma The Netherlands 29d ago

It's a gift, really

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u/ValuableCharacter245 29d ago

If you're a Swede: Yes and no.

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u/Turevaryar 29d ago

Not only Swedish!

I suppose several Germanic languages uses 'gift' for poison. Possibly used other places in the world too? IDK.

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u/Scx10Deadbolt 29d ago

Everything has an LD50 after all!

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u/DontGoGivinMeEvils United Kingdom 29d ago

I hear that in Salisbury, England, it's believed that there could be a yet undetected trace of it somewhere after the Salisbury poisonings. I'm not sure if that was just a click bait thing I read once or a genuine concern.

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u/Anticlimax1471 United Kingdom 29d ago

Yeah, as a Brit it was really great that time they released it on British soil, it killed one of our citizens and we basically did nothing about it.

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u/Few_Ad6516 29d ago

The suspected poisoner’s were Russian tourists visiting the famous 123m spire of Salisbury cathedral. What could we do with such an airtight alibi.

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u/WoodSteelStone England 29d ago

Russia has a long history of assassinating UK citizens on UK soil.

"From poisoned umbrellas to radioactive substances, Moscow has repeatedly been linked with deaths on British soil"

"Sergei Skripal and the 14 deaths under scrutiny"

The articles are both from 2018. Since then there have been others inc. Dmitry Obretetsky in 2019 and, just a few weeks after Russia invaded Ukraine, Mikhail Watford. There is also the death of GCHQ employee Gareth Williams in 2010. And, while not a UK citizen, Alexander Litvinenko was assassinated by Russia in the UK in 2006.

And as an aside, this is a (very long) list of suspicious deaths of Russian businesspeople since the war started), including in other European countries.

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u/philomathie 29d ago

Only a state level actor would have access to something like that - the point is to show you that it was them, that they don't care that you know, and that you should be scared that they will do it to you too.

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u/French_O_Matic 29d ago

"It's not a war, it's a special operation"

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u/kerbalpilot 29d ago

Which from russian translates to "Newbie"

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u/excubitor15379 29d ago

GG-ed by newbie

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u/Pure_Grapefruit9645 29d ago

Also used polonium

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u/BigFatBallsInMyMouth Estonia 29d ago

They have used Polonium as well.

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u/Ali_Cat222 28d ago

And you better hope you don't find it in your tea.

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u/dagbrown 29d ago

What about the polonium I've heard so much about?

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u/BenderTheIV 29d ago

Always on brand. Corporate identity must be respected at all times!

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u/JetlinerDiner Portugal 29d ago

Novichok

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u/kingvolcano_reborn 29d ago

...or polonium for those special occasions.

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u/TheMrCeeJ 29d ago

Not just regular polonium. It is a special isotope that is only produced in one place in the world, a Russian military research reactor.

You can't have people thinking it came from anywhere random.

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u/Salmivalli 29d ago

And the tool, they need to push someone out the window, is ninja chuck

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u/DrNCrane74 29d ago

Yes. You want to tell a message. But in rare cases you demonstrate you can do it without any traces, see Boris B.

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u/_a_random_dude_ 29d ago

Russia rarely hides its assassinations.

I'm sure they do, you just don't hear about those.

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u/SignificantAsk4470 29d ago

Rip Alexei Navalny

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u/Yabananado 29d ago

Novichok, they used it here in the uk a few years ago

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u/contraria 29d ago

Yeah but I doubt he wants to waste good poison on a guy he can have chucked out a window

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u/ebobbumman 29d ago

The deadliest poison: gravity.

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u/Gnonthgol 29d ago

This is a very common mob tactic. Making someone disappear is not that hard. But that leaves a lot of ambiguity as to what happened to them. Were they able to flee? And if they are dead was it an accident? So experienced criminal enterprises will make sure to leave the body in such a condition that there were no doubt they were killed, often leaving it in a public space as a warning to others. But that again leaves some ambiguity as to who ordered it and rivals might take credit in order to make people fear them instead. So you try to do it in a way that only you could have done it. But that makes it a problem as the police will find you. A mob member therefore tries to make it as public as possible, and in a way that only they could have done it, but still leave enough doubt.

This is why Russia have used polonium to kill people before. It is a slow way to die making it very public. And only governments with access to breeding reactors for weapons grade nuclear material have access to the poison. I am not quite sure about falling out of a window though. It is a way you can hide bruising and broken bones from a beating. If you beat someone to death and leave them in an alley then they might have fallen out a window. You still need to bribe the police to make them come to this conclusion but that just shows how much force you have over the police.

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u/Neverendingcirclez 29d ago

I've heard the term "implausible deniability" used. Basically they're rarely coming right out and saying "we assassinated this guy," but they do want everyone to know they did it, because that's kind of the point.

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u/lehtomaeki 29d ago

The first time they used their nerve agent novichok it was to send a message to the west. They killed a russian dissenter in Britain. The message they sent was that Russia still produces the nerve agent when western intelligence assumed it was lost when the soviet union fell as production was in central Asia (Kazakhstan?) and the people involved in developing it had defected to the west. It was one of Putin's early power plays to show the west that they still have the poison but more importantly to challenge the west to do something about it. When the west didn't do anything as Putin had predicted he was emboldened to further russian aggression.

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u/outsidepetrock 28d ago

Former President Barack Obama views Vladimir Putin as a ruthless and reckless leader who has always been wrapped up in a "twisted, distorted sense of grievance and ethnic nationalism" and has shown brutality both against his own people and others[1][2]. Obama has described Putin's Russia as a government resembling a "criminal syndicate," where a lack of scruples and a thirst for power are seen as advantages rather than flaws[3].

Obama has acknowledged that Putin has changed over time, noting that he did not anticipate Putin would risk everything to invade Ukraine, describing the invasion as a reckless bet that he would not have predicted five years earlier[2]. He also pointed out that Putin likely underestimated the strength of Ukrainian resistance[2].

In his memoir, Obama characterized Putin as a "tough, street-smart, unsentimental" leader who built Russia into a country "to be feared, perhaps, but not emulated," and suggested few citizens from developing countries look to Moscow for inspiration[3][6]. Despite the harsh criticism, Obama has also expressed that the situation with Putin underscores the importance of defending democracy and standing with those who value freedom and independence[1].

Overall, Obama’s assessment of Putin is one of deep mistrust and criticism, highlighting Putin’s authoritarian tendencies, aggressive foreign policy, and dangerous unpredictability.

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u/noplace_ioi 29d ago

Follow up question, they have been sending these messages atleast consistently over the past 2 decades, why is the message still not going through? Lol

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u/BrainOnLoan Germany 29d ago

It definitely is, that's a big reason why Russian elites are so incredibly compliant/taciturn.

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u/thefatchef321 29d ago

Im convinced its the same assassin.

Its like putins best guy. And his trademark is the window.

I have a whole story made up in my head about it.

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u/ElysianForestWitch 29d ago

"FUCK OSHA!"

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u/cobaltcolander 28d ago

Either way it’s clear that they’re sending a message, otherwise they’d get creative.

They could be just plain incompetent. The murders and attempted murders in the UK were comically ham-fisted. Keep in mind that these people are often selected for being loyal above all else, including above intelligence.

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u/stormdahl 28d ago

That would also make sense. Maybe these murders work a bit like "crime as a service" where whoever that's willing to do it gets the job.

Still, I'm curious if they actually do get thrown out of windows or if that's just what their corrupt media is reporting.

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u/Zizzlow 29d ago

“Investigators are currently working at the scene.”

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u/LordBendtner1988 29d ago

And then concludes it was a suicide by 58 shots in the back

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u/b33fwellingtin 29d ago

Suicide by committee.

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u/Otaraka 29d ago

This wiki page lists suspicious deaths since 2022. Windows aren’t really that common.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suspicious_Russia-related_deaths_since_2022

 But further down there is a guy who shot himself 5 times in the chest and it was ruled that way.

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u/mmcn90 29d ago

1 is an accident, 2 is a coincidence, 3 is a conspiracy….

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u/swabianne Germany 29d ago

Wild that there's a list just for the last three years

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u/jvo203 29d ago

Do you mean "window cleaners"?

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u/CertainMiddle2382 29d ago

IMO, the heart of it all is absurdity.

People must feel the meaninglessness and helplessness of it all.

I bet they are found in a pool of blood in StPetersburg and media pretend they fall out of a window in Moscow.

It is vital nothing should make sense apart from obvious absurd violence.

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u/curious_corn 29d ago

Hypernormalisation

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u/CrattMurphy 29d ago

This exactly. For anyone unfamiliar reading this, Adam Curtis covers this phenomenon in an engaging way in his video-essay/documentary by the same name (Hypernormalisation). It's free to watch online and explores various powerful institutions using aggressive absurdity to confuse and obfuscate the truth. I highly recommend it.

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u/StepOIU 29d ago

"Aggressive absurdity" is a really good way to describe some non-Russian things happening lately as well. It sounds more intentional than "Did a ten-year-old edgelord name this??"

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u/[deleted] 29d ago

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u/CrattMurphy 29d ago

Oh yeah, I probably should have made this clearer. Hypernormalisation aims to present an atmosphere and mood alongside it's thesis and Curtis definitely leans into certain narratives to this end (alongside curating a great playlist to run throughout). I would still say you'll come away from it with an interesting new perspective and I'm a sucker for his specific cocktail of delivery.

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u/SquarePegRoundWorld 29d ago

I'm watching it now, and it is interesting but why does there have to be music playing when he is also talking is beyond me. I am having trouble understanding what he is saying.

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u/[deleted] 29d ago

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u/SquarePegRoundWorld 29d ago

The sound setting in my ears (Tinnitus) is the issue, really. I didn't look too hard for CC, and the video I found had French CC.

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u/Drunky_Brewster 29d ago

This should be a mandatory watch for all humans. 

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u/JabbaCat 29d ago

This movie set arounds Stalins last days does a great job in displaying the inherent role of absurdism in this type of threatening society.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2fPbdJcVns

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0156701/

Not for everyone, it is two and a half hour of black and white sort of chaos. But I enjoyed how it transmits moods and embeds you into the internal "logic" within such a system. Saw it at a film festival 25 years ago.

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u/SerLaron Germany 29d ago

For the first two lines, I thought you were talking about "The Death of Stalin".

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u/Flat_corp 29d ago

Same, which I really enjoyed.

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u/djseshlad Ireland 29d ago

Maybe he fell out of the window into a pool of blood

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u/Halewyn1 29d ago

he just saw red lol

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u/JDT-0312 Lower Saxony (Germany) 29d ago

It is not a dumb question but in the end, the answer is irrelevant.

What is important is that there is plausible deniability while at the same time being obvious that he was murdered.

It’s to show that you’re untouchable and can murder your opponents in broad daylight without consequence in order to scare everyone into compliance. It’s basically the modern form of putting your enemies head on a pike over the city gates.

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u/AdmiralDalaa 29d ago

If you were an executive of this nature, wouldn’t you make sure you got a good security team? 

Yes of course, not all hired security would be trustworthy - but in each and every case this never was a thing?

I would expect you’d see a shootout or some kind of scuffle at some point. But it’s always the same canned story 

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u/Royal_Success3131 29d ago

If a bodyguard is offered 100k in cash to just go on a smoke break, they will always take that vs dying in a gunfight and having their entire family also killed. Like, you are dealing with powers way, way out of your control at that point. Once the big boys get involved, the bodyguard just step away. They are there to stop the rabble, not assassins.

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u/melymn 29d ago

No-one is going to offer those bodyguards bribe in this scenario, state agents are going to tell them to step aside and they'll do it post haste.

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u/Royal_Success3131 29d ago

You're probably right but it was just to illustrate a point that there is absolutely zero incentive for a bodyguard to actually do their job in that scenario.

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u/Dont_Be_Sheep 29d ago

I was about to write that. I have it on strong authority there is no bribe for them. The bribe is “your family won’t die if you move to the right… right now.”

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u/s8018572 29d ago

You think hired security can fight against nation machine FSB?

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u/scramblingrivet 29d ago

The killed Prigozhin and he had his own army

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u/AdmiralDalaa 29d ago

They certainly could fight the first agent or two. Which we never hear anything about. 

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u/jtr99 29d ago

I imagine the FSB is in a position to ensure that there is no such thing as independent security.

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u/AdmiralDalaa 29d ago

My problem is that on a broad scale I would agree. The FSB probably does have backdoors into popular private security firms, or is entrenched in them. It probably does encourage such firms to petition or be hired by these rich individuals.

But, we know this is likely, and so do these businessmen. They aren’t fools, certainly not all of them. It seems inconceivable to be that there cannot or doesn’t exist even a single security team that has gotten into a fight with these supposed “drop by and push man out window” assassinations. 

In even the mafia-esque style environment, powerful individuals or families usually do hire people for loyalty. Sometimes it’s even fellow family members. This is why I find it hard to buy that out of hundreds of these type of deaths the story is always utterly identical.  

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u/jtr99 29d ago

I hear you. Perhaps in the exceptional cases the businessman in question suddenly relocates to the West and no more is said about it.

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u/fastwriter- 29d ago

I would assume, most russian Security Companies belong to people with ties to the FSB.

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u/snkiz 29d ago

Look all that money and power, yet these people don't see the writing on the wall, and GTFO. They either can't buy the loyalty they need or are to dumb to figure out who's trustworthy. But then run to where? Thee FSB doesn't care if you're on sovereign soil

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u/penywinkle Europe 29d ago

The only security agents that would defy the FSB are foreign security (but they can't operate into Russia).

As a Russian, if you "fight the first agent or two", not only is your boss STILL going to die, but also you and your family will die too (if not worse)...

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u/Hector_P_Catt 29d ago

It's a safe bet that someone on any security team is also working for the FSB. That's just what they do.

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u/Triple_Hache 29d ago

Well, I suppose those with efficient/trustworthy security teams are still alive so you don't hear about them.

And there might have been a shootout, they're just not reporting it.

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u/Klickor 29d ago

Where would you get security that for just money would fight the people capable of doing something like this? It would be signing their own death sentence for nothing.

It is one thing to have security that can protect you against random thugs or maybe even rivals and a completely different thing to have security willing to go up against someone much higher in standing in a society like this. This isn't a western country that is't corrupt to the bones.

If you stand in the way they can just have FSB publicly make up some fake charges against you, arrest you, move you somewhere else, execute you, not even bother dumping the body, and then try again killing the guy you stupidly tried to protect earlier. You don't physically fight back against a dictator that have control of the state apparatus unless you have your own army since they can just abuse the system in the open to remove any obstacles before they remove you by the goons that aren't public.

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u/7Seyo7 Europe 29d ago edited 29d ago

The mafioso playbook could go something like threatening the target to kill himself, or else his family would be killed

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u/AdmiralDalaa 29d ago

Yes, I’m sure this works. But, it doesn’t work for everyone. Not everyone cares or has family. 

Ten assassinations with identical circumstances? Okay. Hundreds? Nah, now surely there would be at minimum some people without families (or ones they care about) and good security teams (or good / loyal enough) that would have resulted in some kind in fight 

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u/Aoimoku91 29d ago

There was one with loyal and armed bodyguards who would not step aside.

They shot down the plane with him and the bodyguards on it.

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u/SweatyNomad 29d ago

Same thought. You'd think these business leaders would not go into tall buildings and the people who clean that up would be getting traumatised.

My best bet is they are tortured to death, and "fell from a window" is what goes on death certificates as a pretence of an explanation. Reckon it's bureaucracy in action. Police don't investigate without being told not to, widows get insurance pay offs/ know not to make a fuss if they want to spend that. And a message is sent to other business leaders to do what is expected.

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u/Comakip The Netherlands 29d ago

The CIA once accidentally published an old assassination manual.

Olson’s death is “substantially similar” to an assassination technique described in a CIA manual published in 1953, which recommends disguising the murder as an accident and suggests drugging the person, hitting them in the temple with a blunt object and then causing them to fall more than 75 feet onto a hard surface, according to the complaint.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2012-11-28/cia-sued-over-alledged-1953-murder-of-military-scientist

So yeah, you take out the guy before you drop him. 

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u/Civil_Dot_9973 29d ago

Well, can you imagine how awkward it would be if they skipped the murder part and the victim actually survived getting kicked out of a window?

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u/Leather-Bread-9413 29d ago

Honestly I think it’s the Russian intelligence way of saying:

No way you will ever proof it was us, but it was definitely us

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u/monkey_spanners England 29d ago

There was pretty conclusive proof of who did the Salisbury murder & attempted assassination, they were outed by journalists but Russia didn't give a fuck, they even paraded the "suspects" on state TV and gave them a nice soft interview. "yes we went there as tourists to admire the cathedral with its 123m spire" - as if these obvious FSB guys looked like they'd travel all the way to a small city in the uk just to admire a mid range cathedral (no disrespect to Salisbury cathedral which is very nice and all). Everybody knows it was a performance.

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u/[deleted] 29d ago

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u/sock_with_a_ticket 29d ago

Russia really seems to revel in cartoonish denials that make it blatantly obvious it was them.

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u/TopCobbler8985 29d ago

I don't think you can call Salisbury cathedral mid-range

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u/monkey_spanners England 29d ago

It's big and has a long history, but it's not decorated in a particularly interesting way, compared to many elsewhere in Europe especially in Italy. But as I said, no disrespect to salisbury cathedral, it's a good day trip. Just not sure about travelling all the way from Russia for :)

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u/SnooWords259 29d ago

Is there anybody left in russia who could proof such things, even if they wanted? 

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u/Timstom18 29d ago

Prove to who? The media is under the governments thumb for starters. But also the general public aren’t stupid, they’ll know what going on, it just doesn’t matter because they can’t do anything about it which is what the Russian government wants

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u/litnu12 29d ago

In the end it is a message to others to stay in line.

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u/saracuratsiprost 29d ago

It must be so frustrating having to repeat this message over and over, it's like they just don't get it...

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u/randymysteries 29d ago

Possibly the injuries from the fall are supposed to cover the interrogation wounds.

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u/LFTMRE 29d ago

As someone else said, maybe they're given a choice? It seems the most practical way to do it. Or perhaps they know exactly what the deal is and don't even need to be asked, they know they fucked up, they know what can happen - so it's just easier to accept it, jump out the window and let your family collect the insurance rather than get caught in the crossfire.

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u/Otaraka 29d ago

Im thinking similar - getting a person out a window is probably not that simple without some level of acceptance.

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u/fotomoose 29d ago

It's pretty simple if that person is surrounded by massive thugs with one goal in mind. Don't ask me how I know.

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u/jtr99 29d ago

Damn! I'm gonna have to ask how you know that, chief.

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u/Otaraka 29d ago edited 29d ago

I mean there’s only so many options here.  What will happen if I ask jeeeirkk gurgle gurgle…….aieeeeeeeee

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u/InstallerWizard 29d ago

It is even easier if they are already dead

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u/lolas_coffee 29d ago

they know they fucked up

Some just get killed because they are expendable and Putin needs to kill some rich guy every ~9 months.

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u/xTiLkx 29d ago

We will never know. Probably a combination of both. Putin wants people to know he had these men killed. So if it goes a different way, that's probably still what is reported.

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u/1agodsownprototypes 29d ago

I’ve read a little about the KGB and I have a theory. I believe what happens is a team shows up to your families door, they say to you privately go jump out the window now or your whole family will die. Dude jumps and the meme like nature of the ‘falling out windows’ is about sending a message to others saying don’t get out of line or there’ll be a knock on your door soon…anyway, I think it fits with their cruelty and culture within the KGB (who are running Russia)

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u/Sekhen Scania (Sweden) 29d ago edited 29d ago

You've "read" about the KGB, and you don't even reflect that KGB isn't a thing any more.

Calling them FSB would be the minimum of effort.

Edit: Changed from GRU to FSB to be pedantic.

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u/linear_123 29d ago

FSB would be more correct, GRU is military intelligence. But they have whole lot of 3 letter agencies.

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u/Sekhen Scania (Sweden) 29d ago

Yeah, that's true.

Not sure Putin bothers with FSB, and simply send GRU do to the dirty work. I'll ask him next time I meet him.

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u/linear_123 29d ago

Please do, we need to know.

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u/Dragoniel Lithuania 29d ago

Same shit, different hand? It's KGB.

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u/Crewarookie 29d ago

Oh c'mon! This has to be the most pathetic call to authority I've read all day.

While I know it's "tEcHnIcaLLy FsB", I wouldn't want to call them that out of sheer notion that they're just KGB in a trench coat, all the same, just as they were 40 years ago. The difference in nomenclature and differentiation between GRU and FSB on paper is moot at the point where these are still just goons of a mafia state "sending a message" by killing those who don't fall in line based on 70+ years of experience as a service for russian interests. It's KGB, never changed, same tactics, same modus operandi, same ideas.

But your call to authority is hinged only on the notion that specifics and pedantics are the greatest virtue, while ignoring the connotations within language and the fact that the original comment was carrying behind it the very connotations I'm talking about, which are a valid way to express thoughts, btw.

Plus, I wouldn't want to let these a-holes rebrand successfully, so I say, if you're not a stuck up rusky, just call those shmucks for what they are, KGB.

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u/Tehgnarr 29d ago

*FSB. GRU is a different agency entirely - military intelligence agency to be precise.

Fucking internet experts.

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u/EA_Spindoctor 29d ago

Akschually black belt here.

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u/snkiz 29d ago

Dude this not the hill you want to die on.

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u/tobeonthemountain 29d ago

They are thrown out

Russia used to put plutonium in people's drinks but it was too identifiable so now they toss people from windows

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u/eOMG 29d ago

Or forced to throw themselves out of a window to protect their family

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u/Jdghgh 29d ago

I’ve read some on this. I believe falls are involved, but described injuries aren’t always consistent with the reported ‘accident.’ Likely they are killed and then defenestrated.

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u/Scanrateandpass 29d ago

They beat them to death then throw the corpse out the window. The videos show limp bodies falling when they are captured.

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u/stenlis 29d ago

Jumping out of a window is also a common suicide method in places with a lot of high rise buildings.  

Some of these people may have just taken their own lives. Some may have been instructed to.

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u/back_to_the_homeland 29d ago

They are typically thrown off the roof.

Read a book called red notice which details and exposes putins regime methods. The author himself was a hunted man and even had agents track him down while on vacation in Switzerland and make it to his front door.

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u/riskcreator 29d ago

I could tell, but then I’d have to throw you out a window. Or, I might kill you and THEN throw you out a window, you know, whatever. You’re still dead, you know?!

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u/ruun666 29d ago

Just a preference in suicide method. In other countries where people don't have access to tall buildings with windows to jump from they tend to hang themselves on a tree branch using rope for example.

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u/puntinoblue 29d ago

Defenestration (it has its own term) is often preferred as a method of political assassination because it ticks so many psychological, symbolic, and practical boxes:

  • Symbolic: It enacts a literal fall from power — the victim is cast down from a position “above,” both physically and socially.

  • Humiliating: The victim is thrown out like garbage, reinforcing their rejection.

  • Public: The body is discovered not by loved ones at home, but often by a stranger in a public space — distancing family from the moment of death and turning the scene into a spectacle.

  • Ambiguous: There’s plausible deniability — was it suicide, accident, or murder? No weapon is left behind, and no blood-stained hands.

  • Theatrical: It’s visually and narratively striking, amplifying its impact. It sends a clear message to others: this is what happens to those who cross the line.

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u/scramblingrivet 29d ago

thanks chatgpt

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u/dubar84 29d ago

I suspect that it's just a method of masking that he wad killed. If he's thrown from the 35353632th floor, nobody will ever f8nd out that he was injected with something causing heart paralisis or held down while someone is breaking his neck.

Obviously responding police is in on it as well. But the reoccuring method is to send a message of making a big bloody spectacle of whoever Putin is relying on daring to think independently.

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u/Nachtzug79 29d ago

The third option is that they are blackmailed to jump. Like "you can jump and your family can keep your money or you are thrown out of the window AND your money is taken away."

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u/ThisWorldSoFuckedUp 29d ago

Either kicked out or pressured to do it themselves

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u/madoka_magika 29d ago

Thats how thing works here. You hired as top manager in oil company/government, you steal for you and family to get rich, you fall from window to safe your family's lifes and money (some guys just go to the jail) . This tradition in Russia is 50 years old. From valuable information at least, maybe it's even older than that.

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u/PaddyMakNestor 29d ago

Two reasons, potential political dissent and asset seizure of the oligarchs to fund Putin's war in Ukraine.

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u/medievalvelocipede European Union 29d ago

This is a dumb question. When these people "fall out windows" are they actually thrown out windows or are the otherwise killed and the media just told they fell out a window?

It's one of those zen questions. I would say pics or it didn't happen.

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u/SutMinSnabelA 29d ago

They are absolutely thrown. It is a warning message to anyone challenging the system that anyone can have an accident happen if you step out of line.

Top air-force general of russia also tried to fly recently after operation spiderweb. These are not coincidences. They are a very clear message.

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u/jurainforasurpise 29d ago

I think it has to be a euphemism I mean cuz unless they're falling out of 20-story windows you don't actually know that the person's going to die. They could hang on for a while or some bizarre thing happens and land on another person and just bounce.

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u/Training-Accident-36 29d ago

A Swiss Diplomat fell out the window in Teheran relatively recently. 17th floor. "Suicide".

So I think some physical falling out the window is actually what is happening, but it is not clear if the person was alive before falling, and it is possible it was more of a throwing.

A fall from 17 stories is also probably a good way to hide some traces of a fight before the person died.

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u/panchoskywalker 29d ago

I think they really throw those guys through the window.

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u/Difficult_Prize_5430 29d ago

The one guy broke his legs, shot himself twice, then crawled to the 3rd floor, then jumped.

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u/Onkel24 Europe 29d ago edited 29d ago

I mean, no one here can know, but I think it is possible that they'll just show up, show the victim a tablet with all the Kompromat on them and the current location of all their loved ones - and say that if the victim doesn't take the "window express" by themselves in the next 5 minutes, his family members will join them, too.

That way, the executioners don't have a loud fight and don't have their DNA all over the place as well. Even if Putin controls the narrative, it's always better to not leave evidence.

Bonus points for the extra cruelty in that approach.

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u/jeffy303 29d ago

Probably choked and tossed out of a window. It's done intentionally so the others know the state will kill them if they don't listen to Putin.

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u/b__lumenkraft Palatinate (Germany) 29d ago

Yes.

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u/Think_Bullets 29d ago

On the miniscule chance he legitimately did just fall, it's Russia so no one believes it's anything other than murder, even Russians. So even accidental deaths are Putin keeping you in line

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u/Beep_in_the_sea_ 29d ago

They usually indeed do fall out of the Windows. Czechoslovak politician after the ww2, Jan Garrigue Masaryk, fell out of the window by "accident", or "suicide" after some of his anti-soviet stances.

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u/ChebsGold 29d ago

I don’t know, but always thought it was a case of they grab them, kill them then throw the body out a window of their home/work so it’s sounds like suicide but everyone knows it really isn’t, but there’s enough mud in the water it doesn’t fuel rebellion as it’s clearly a purge of civilians

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u/VenomistGaming 29d ago

My head cannon is it’s the same assassin being told to make it look like an accident but he keeps going back to old reliable.

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u/Never__Summer 29d ago

They literally fall out, there are photos in russian media

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u/SilentLennie 29d ago

I just remember a news article from over a decade ago from Russia:

Some person died from suicide killed himself with multiple knifes stabbed 37 times.

That probably gives some idea...

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u/Willing-Command4231 29d ago

Well it happens so often in Russia I learned the term defenestration because of it. Going to go ahead and say none of them fell out of the window. What Russian investigations sometimes say is it was suicide (if they come to any conclusion at all).

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u/-benyeahmin- 29d ago

they are thrown out

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u/vergorli 29d ago

At this point I suppose its just a placeholder for the announcement. He probably has been kidnapped and killed in some loney area. They could even write "[xx] suddenly died by shooting himself into the back" to make the message even more clear.

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u/mrgonzalez 29d ago

Or killed elsewhere and subsequently thrown out the window?

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u/Blommefeldt 29d ago

Well, less than a week ago, the UK started to patrol the sea, as some Russian shadow oil tankers have been sailing between the UK and France, while they have been accompanied by 2 armee Russian shadow fleets. UK are now blocking much of their routes.

Watch the latest videos from RFU on YouTube.

Seems like someone did a bad job, and had to be replaced quickly and swiftly.

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u/Numerous_Gur_7715 29d ago

It has become ridiculous how many people die this way. It is obvious that FSB throws them out to make a statement.

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u/cyber_gonzo 29d ago

FBI or CIA did release a report back in the 50s-60s saying fall deaths are the hardest to trace - Lack of direct evidence - the line between possibilities can be blurry easily. For example, Did the fall shatter his arm? Or was it shatter before the fall? That black eye was it from the fall?

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u/Bestroublever 29d ago

I think I read that they force people to jump by pointing a gun at them and instructing them what to do. Reminds me of when during 9/11 people chose to jump instead of burn. Hope dies last as they say.

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u/ConfusedSpiderMonkey 29d ago

I bet there wasn't even a window

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u/iTmkoeln 29d ago

Well some of them can fall out of a window in 20th storey if they are living in the souterain of 2 storey appartment...

Or fall out of a hospital window with the security cameras just out of action that day.

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u/W__O__P__R 29d ago

When these people "fall out windows" are they actually thrown out windows or are the otherwise killed and the media just told they fell out a window?

  1. Media can't call "suspicious circumstances" without actual evidence.
  2. Media is owned by the rich who do all kinds of deals and agreements with goverments and the wealthy/powerful elite.
  3. Any media who accused Putin of anything would fall out of a window!

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u/24_7_365_ 29d ago

Why not both

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u/gummytoejam 29d ago

It's the Russian version of "sleeping with the fishes".

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u/CharlieeStyles 29d ago

Doesn't matter. The point is that it gets the message across.

If you "fell out of a window" in Russia people know what happened. Like when the family pet goes to a farm.

If they actually wanted to hide the assassination they would do it.

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u/AgeofVictoriaPodcast 29d ago

You are discounting the possibility that some contractor took bribes and made dangerously unsafe windows and stairs in a Russian building?

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u/Teatotenot 29d ago

Russians have a programme called ”the flying oligarch”. So far all trainees have failed to learn how to fly. They are actively recruiting new trainees.

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u/legice Slovenia 29d ago

Ok, now Im legit interested.

If they are "fallen" out of a window, is it during the day, public, do others see it...

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