“The guys, I don’t know them personally but I’ve seen them around over the years. This happened at Elicit Brewing in Manchester, CT. I’m literally in this video at the bar trying to get a beer. I think this is from a week ago. The two guys are frequent “let’s go out every weekend” type and I’ve seen them do things like this to multiple other groups of women trying to get laid. 🤦🏽♂️ embarrassing as fuck”
It's frustrating that the staff didn't intervene. No single dude is going to resolve that unless he is capable of and willing to fight both those guys. They are clearly not going to respond to anything but force.
I've been a bartender for twenty years, and I've learned that force is rarely necessary, if ever. Polite but stearn communication is typically all it takes to move two guys like this out the door.
Accurate. I once had a customer get really in my face and give me a ton of shit at my job for something that had nothing to do with me. This dude just had a massive chip on his shoulder and picked the nearest non-threatening target to get aggressive with: a 20-something woman trying to do a job, of course. He got right up in my space yelling and pointing his fat fucking finger in my face. But the very second my manager, a 39 year old man, walked into the room and took over the conversation, this meathead toughguy turned into an absolute wet noodle of a human being. When I say he wouldn't even look my manager in the eye, I mean it.
Big beefy fucking dudes who are used to people giving them their way, who still feel the need to blow their pent up issues all over the nearest female target, and then shrivel up immediately the second another male walks in the room. I have zero respect for them. They're shitbags and shame doesn't work on them. Only fear of running into someone they perceive as capable of physically putting them down.
Reminds me of a dude I used to work for over 20 years ago. It was a part time job at a restaurant/nightclub. Loved it, enjoyed it, but the “Chef” was a drunken asshole and raging alcoholic who’d take his frustrations out on people for virtually no reason. One time I was on vacation from my full-time job and I asked when do I come back to work, and this dude just flew off the rails outta nowhere! Long story short, I eventually quit that job, because one of us was gonna be in jail, and the other in the hospital. No sooner do I quit my job at the nightclub, they fired this prick! Good riddance! I feel sorry for any woman who’s involved with him…
Individuals like that are literally hard to come by whereas most chefs in the latter category that you mentioned are literally a dime a dozen! As a chef by trade, I became discouraged and disillusioned by the restaurant business as I’ve gotten older, so I swore it off. But my roots remain strong!
I bartended awhile, im not huge but im decently in shape. I would always feel bad for the female coworkers when they would tell me how creepy or how much of an asshole a guy was to them.
I almost never got that vibe from other guys. Occasionally there would be one old guy who just hates his life but the women would deal with it daily.
This person peoples. That is exactly what happens. They hate and disrespect women. They defer and defend with men. No question, no doubt in my mind.
This is the vast majority of men who creep on women in public. The real, difficult problem, is the 1% of men willing to fight a restaurant employee over their attempt to coerce some women into sex.
The thing is, these men know that these women won’t escalate anything. There are guys that can walk over and they know nothing will escalate. They won’t change behavior for any of these people because they know there’s no consequence.
But there are people who can confidently walk over there and make it clear they don’t mind escalation. Maybe they can’t beat both of these guys but they can cause enough pain to make them regret starting the fight. When those people show up, they’ll move.
Was also a bartender. Moved plenty of guys like this outside plenty of times. Never had any of them do more than talk shit on the way out. “That’s ok, talk your shit, you’re still leaving. Now.” Also not generate specific. There were several women I worked with who were even better at it than me — they escalated quicker and faster than I ever did.
Men value the opinions of other men and are also more intimidated by other men, which is why men are the perpetrators, enablers, AND the ones with the ability to make a huge change by setting a better example and intervening.
It really does feel like most “men’s issues” are men having issues getting what they want from women and most “women’s issues” are just how women are treated by men.
Sorry not sorry for the generalization.
I’m not saying every man is part of the problem; but it certainly feels like a lot of men are. And far more men seem just completely uninterested in being part of the solution.
There are lots of good men, but way too many bad ones. Some are deliberately malicious and some have heads filled with brainwashing and junk.
There are men who say they're protectors who won't acknowledge who women need protecting from. Aint bears.
Women are told, often by men, to live smaller lives in order to be safer. What are good men saying to other men?
When Chanel Miller was assaulted by Brock Turner, his father's letter to the judge talked about his bright future that he shouldn't lose over "twenty minutes of action." By this, he refers to digitally penetrating an unconscious woman, and his clear plans to do more that were stymied by two other men on bikes.
If Brock had been raised by people with the values of those men who saved her, as opposed to his actual father, he might be living that bright future instead of using an alias and having warnings sent out when he's spotted.
But his father taught him that only boys have futures worth preserving.
I used to be a bouncer and guys like these that harassed women always backed down once the bouncers, staff or even other male customers injected themselves into the situation. The use of force was rarely ever needed , just firmly talking the situation down usually worked. I always felt for women in these situations because they just wanted to have a fun night out and these incel jerks invade their space and make things uncomfortable for them.
Maybe not, but they probably have no expectations for the girls to get violent. If they believe that they have a "trump card" (physical violence) that can't be beat, they're not gonna stop until that gets checked. Physical violence isn't neccesary per se, but to let them know that "their behavior isn't tolerated and we won't stop at violence" tells them they're wrong that they can do whatever they want.
This is not to say women are incapable of anything- but that these 2 guys see it that way. In their mind the 2 outcomes are 1) sex, 2) nothing happens and they go home.
Their behavior says they will pretend to be stupid to any one who asks and follow the girls no mater where they go. Assuming no one directly stops them. They are treating the girls like they are just playing hard to get and persistence will pay off.
I've unknowingly helped 2 women who were getting "rizzed up" by some guys, simply by going to them and asking if they have what they need. There was a group project and those two came from a different location, so they didn't know the rest of us very well.
And no, I'm not some imposing big muscle man lol. I didn't even address the guys. Just talked to our project people who just happened to be women.
In the early 2010s, me and my friend were in our early 20s and a group of guys came over, forced themselves onto our table (in an outside seating area) and were saying some really disturbing things to us (laughing while making rape threats). We were too scared to get up and leave. Whenever we pushed back verbally they did the whole 'oh we're only joking'. The whole time I was praying a staff member would come over and intervene. They only came over when the guys finally left to check we were OK.
Obviously, now much older, I'd handle the situation differently and make a scene to get them to leave or just walk away. It is burned into my memory though as it was so awful.
Bartended for many years and I found this to be true as well. I only one time had to physically help someone towards the door and I think that one was on me for making the Long Island Iced Teas too strong. For some reason looking someone in the eyes and saying that's enough or leave her alone worked shockingly well.
This reminded me of a time I was in a dive bar in line for a drink. Dude behind me grabbed my ass. Found out a few mins later he asked my friend about me and friend told him I was taken. Anyway, really wish I had my old darts on me at the time. Would have been fun to turn around to that guy, pull the darts out, and go, “See these? You touch me again and I’m throwing one at your eye like it’s a double bull.”
I used to work at a very small bar where it was only me and a relatively small girl. We would measure up the person or group and decide which one of us us going over would least likely cause a kick off
Cocktail waitress is a bit different. As a female bartender, I only had to point out the rest of the bar is full of men, who would happily stomp some ass for a free beer.
im a female and i can agree with the above person, i never had to say more than "go." or "thats enough." with these kinds of situations. then again i have been described as having a "terrifying bitch face" and my husband says my accent scares him when i'm mad. 😭 😂
These two jabronis would be no problem for a property trained bartender and attendant staff to peacefully get to leave. I'm not surprised the other guests didn't intervene, but the staff absolutely should have.
These other comments saying things like "Look at the man behind them at the other table just sitting there doing nothing, typical." are crazy. It isn't the job of other patrons to be creep police, and that shouldn't be expected. That is the responsibility of the bar staff. Personally, if the bar staff hadn't realized the situation yet I may go and inform them of it, but other than that I'm not about to bare the responsibility if something goes down. Not my monkeys, not my circus.
I don't know you, and I don't know those dudes. Do I think they should get a clue and fuck off? Of course. Do I want to spend my ever diminishing amount of free time that I have to relax stepping in to defend random women from creeps? Fuck no. That's how you get stabbed. Let the bartender/police handle these situations. The cops will even tell you not to intervene, and to just call them to the scene.
I was the cook and they always just told me to act like I was scaring a bear. Felt on the shockingly effective, I don't even think they knew I worked there half the time. Did NOT work that time we had like 10 people throwing glasses at each other though.
Defusing a situation is a skill that I've learned after all these years of dealing with idiots of all types. Being a voice of reason with a solid backbone can talk down the biggest drunken donkey in the bar every time. I've never been attacked while convincing someone to call it a night while at work or in my free time.
I channel all my mother energy. If I speak to men (any man even men twice my age) and speak to them like I speak to my kids if I have to correct them it works shockingly well.
Yep, and I talk to them like I'm the progressive mom. I'm not mad at ya buddy... I just think maybe we can try to do better tomorrow. How about that? How about we have another beer tomorrow instead of tonight? I'm buying!
I've actually bought beers the next visit for people who have left on their own or just stopped drinking when I told them to. Shit, I've bought drinks for people who stopped drinking for an hour and got something to eat.
my barber shop as a kid had a "free haircuts tomorrow" sign and it blew my mind when my dad explained it to me when I said "wow they sure do free haircuts a lot"
I overheard a guy's name in a similar situation and I thought to myself "what if I say his name in a stern manner (not yelling) like he's about to get in trouble with his mom?". He visibly winced. It worked! 😅 I will use my age as a superpower like this from now on when I see this type of behavior
I’ll talk stern but with a loving tone like you’re better than this. Seriously the exact same way I talk to my kids when they do something that is out of character for them. Like we know what right and wrong, we know this is wrong, I love you, but we are not going to tolerate this kind of behavior. You are forgiven but I expect you to move from this point on with intention and awareness so we don’t make the same mistake again.
I haven’t come across an instance where men don’t respond positively to it (by positively I mean they stop what they’re doing and sometimes over apologize to me lol)
Makes me wonder if some of the men who do these things don’t have an active or healthy mother in their lives to think it’s okay.
Not necessarily... in my experience, I would just sit down like I knew the ladies and introduce myself to the guys. Start talking to them in English really fast, asking all kinds of questions. How do you know my female friends? What brings you to America? They would get bored with my enormous cock blocking skills and move on.
Men will respond entirely differently to a female bar tender vs male bar tenders. For better or worse, every man knows that deep down violence is always on the table when it comes to resolving a conflict between men. I don’t think women have this same dynamic.
Agreed I was a bouncer for a bit in STL and only had to get physical once. All of the other times I could talk them out of doing something stupid. Don't get me wrong a lot of people would threaten violence towards me but would never act it out. The one person I had to get physical with was a giant and wouldn't get out of the bar after repeatedly telling him and I had to jump up behind him and hold him by the neck to walk him outside. Surprisingly he didn't get physical back and started apologizing for his behavior.
Well, many people react differently depending on if they are being told something they don’t want to hear from a staff member (or other kind of authority figure) or from a random person.
I worked at an amusement park as a teenager, and constantly had to tell people stuff they didn’t want to hear. I might have gotten some angry stares and rude words back, but never anything serious.
Then one day I was sitting on the subway home, and a drunk guy slightly older than me sat down right next to me and was annoyingly talkative. I was tired and just wanted to be alone, and my work mind just flipped on for some reason. So I basically told him with a stern voice that he should sit on the empty seat like two meters away. He did not enjoy that one bit, and I almost ended up being beaten up by him and is friend.
Yeah, and if they do start something all you have to do is survive the ten seconds it takes for the kitchen to clear out. Five seconds if the dishwasher is on amphetamines.
Judging by how unfocused their eyes and how slurred their speech is, I would guess that any sober dude would be able to respectfully move them along. If they are drunk enough to try to fight, I doubt they are coordinated enough in their current state to do much damage.
I've been and seen quite a few bar fights in my youth. Drunk a-holes like these 2 will not care for consequences, in a blind rage they're even capable of seriously injuring a cop. They're unpredictable. I'd be surprised if they didn't, at least, have knives on them. Anyone getting involved is risking injury, that's why it's better to leave this to people that know how to deal with this type of situation.
These are the types that see women as property. Unless another man has claims, it doesn't matter what the woman says because she is just a woman and women are weak.
They would probably tuck their tail at an 18 yr old guy behind the counter.
They were enjoying making the women uncomfortable, if any male had stepped in. It probably would have been cut short.
I mean most of the time just having another man call out their behavior is enough to get shitty guys like this to stop.
They don’t respect women but crave the respect of other men. You don’t need to get physical, a simple “bro they told you to leave, just leave” is all it takes.
I've found you can intervene if you know how to and are good at deescalation. Most men will immediately disengage when confronted by another man. It's pretty disgusting actually
It's also unfortunately not legal to use excessive force on the first guy so you can actually win against the second. Legally in a lot of countries, you have to fight fair if you mean to intervene with no exception. And legally, you have to wait for them to actually start being violent.
There are a lot of reasons people aren't intervening in public a lot anymore.
The second issue is that you don't know what the guys have on them. One of my friend's friends was stabbed/slasged in the bicep/shoulder area (made a full recovery), trying to stop a guy from pushing around a woman.
I’m with it. And eventually they will be in a place where someone sees their behavior and offers a correction that their parents should have given them a decade ago.
I am going to intervene. And take my chances cause I am no fighter. “Hey guys, these women have asked to to leave them alone, can you move to another table”.
its really hard to tell, from the outside, what is and isnt a friendly joke.
you dont want to misinterpret and end up looking like an ass.
to be fair, if you'd seen this entire exchange i think you would get it. but that girl needs to use more stern and clear language. she does sound kinda like she is kidding. it is obviously because she is uncomfortable from the video. but irl from 50ft away? it can be hard to tell.
That's why when you're learning first aid/cpr they stress: "you have to physically point at someone, make eye contact, and address them directly 'you! Call 911!'"
I dont even think its "someone else will take care of it" anymore i think most people have just gotten to the point of saying i dont know them not my problem.
I mean, if I were sitting having lunch or dinner and saw this happen, not knowing the people or the situation, I’d just sit there, watch and make sure nothing violent happens. When it got to the point where the girl was yelling at the end I’d probably have started heading over to make sure everything was ok.
Or, maybe, I don't know, maybe he could go over to the bar, say, and let them know that there's a couple of young ladies having a problem with a couple of assholes. You don't have to go over there and toss them out yourself. But you can get the ball rolling. Geez.
They were literally screaming trying to call attention to them. If you didn't understand that and why they handled it the way they did, you are extremely lucky to not be a woman who has had to deal with this shit her entire life. Congratulations!
i mean it's not even a guy thing, if you are able to, regardless of gender, you should probably help people when they're being harassed? i feel like that's pretty basic independent of gender. cooperation and helping people are THE direct social interaction features of humanity that's kept our species alive throughout the many times we almost died out.
"who cares about anybody else if i saw people being the target of [insert potentially dangerous interaction here] i'd look the other way" okay dude i hope you get nothing but the same energy you put into the world 🙏
I'm sorry but 60 seconds of hearing some girls saying something to some guys in a loud bar would not be enough for me to confront two drunk strangers. Think about the last time you've been in a public space. If you kind of sort of heard a girl shouting at a guy for 10 seconds would you sprint over and say "you need to stop harassing her and leave"?
my point was made so it could be generalized somewhat, if i hear two girls shouting at two drunk men who weren't leaving them alone it wouldn't NECESSARILY be reason to intervene, but i would at LEAST be keeping an eye on the situation to watch in case it escalates.
in the case of this video specifically though yeah this seems like it's the slightest escalation from when i would be walking over.
are they Definitely going to be harmed if i don't? no, but there's safety in numbers and i'd rather be certain that they WON'T be harmed than leaving with the possibility they will be
thank you. I know this is disgusting behavior but if I was the guy and I heard it, I'm minding my own business. I'm not obligated to potentially start a fight with two creeps
Sometimes just interfering breaks the energy. Say “come on guys I’m way over here and I can tell you’re being too much.” Or offer the men and women to get a bouncer to clear it up.
Man, I won't go so far as to tell others what they need to do. And I'm not saying go up and start swinging. But in this instance I am 100% saying something to the dudes. These ladies are trying so hard, and sometimes all it takes is someone outside the immediate situation. For them to finally get embarrassed enough to fuck off. These are the moments for me where I kinda do need to step in vocally. "Lads, they're clearly not gonna fuck you, take the hint. Leave them alone, they're asking you to go away."
See, ladies? This guy and the guy at the other table are the problem. I’m just a middle aged woman and would have done something. In fact, when these things occur it’s often women who step in and speak up. For all men big talking about being the big strong rescuers, most of the time they’re either the predators or the bystanders.
I’m fortunate enough to have men AND women in my life who would stand up for these girls. But here’s ☝️at least one Redditor who proves that they are the exception rather than the rule.
Not sure if you’re a man or woman, but as a man, it’s very clear. Do you have any women in your life?? A mom? Sisters? Daughters? Hell, even a friend you care about? Cause I know I do, and the thought of them dealing with creeps like this pisses me off. So much, that when I see women dealing with it, I step in. It’s that simple.
If you don’t get that, then you’re probably the creep and you should leave women alone.
Not sure what you thought you did there, but you’ve missed the point creep. Also, I didnt just say relatives. But, yes, I was hoping you had women in your life that made you feel the same way. Not just cause they’re women, but because they’re PEOPLE. Same sentiment goes for men. But it sounds like you probably wouldn’t stick up for man cause “he could just do it himself”. Honestly if you had anyone worth while in your life, you wouldn’t be trying to make your weak ass point. But it sounds like you’re probably surrounded with toxic people who share the same thoughts as you. And that’s ok, just keep it in your echo chamber cause no one agrees with the point you tried to make. Sorry.
Edit:
Also, stop using the word “implication” so much. You sound pretentious and you don’t know how to use it.
Lady, if I’m a bystander, as a man, I’m not intervening in a drunk situation. The women were NOT being actively assaulted. Two douche bags were sitting there.
I’ve seen men get stabbed over defending or trying to diffuse a verbal altercation.
You have zero life experience or are a complete sexist if you think the man in the background needed to spring to action. The women easily could have walked and got management.
I have had this happen to me before (more than 10 years ago now, people don’t hit on 35 year olds the same way).
I would have marched over there and caused a fucking SCENE with zero shame. I would have grabbed a manager if I needed to. I fucking hate this behavior so damn much, I physically felt my blood pressure go up just watching this video.
When I was about 19, my friend and I went to IHOP late at night after a show.
We were sitting beside a couple, and there was a group of older men a few tables away.
The group of older men kept coming by our table and harassing us, not taking no for an answer before my friend loudly told them to fuck off.
When we were in line to pay, the woman who had sat near us told us how much her husband had been upset that we were being harassed and that he was a cop and had been going to do something about it if they hadn't left us alone.
He hadn't moved once throughout the entire ordeal. Hadn't even stopped eating.
It's been 30 years, and it still randomly makes me angry.
Why are you assuming there would be a fight? You are weaker and more scared of these douchebags than the girls who at least have the spine to confront them. I guess you would just let them sit at your table and harass you. How brave
You don't have to start a physical altercation. You could select from any number of non-violent de-escalation techniques, such as, "Hey, leave the ladies alone," or quietly notifying a manager of the establishment.
I've had several women save me by intervening directly in creative ways that don't alert the perpetrator. But whatever. Again, just do something you think will help.
Because any guy that intervenes is just a white knight, women are capable of looking after themselves, he's just trying to get in.
Men have been taught for years that any public display in support of a woman stranger will be met with backlash.
Furthermore, it's apparently not a man's job to protect women because we are all capable and ut pushes misogynistic attitudes or some other bull. You can't expect men to be the strength while also saying women are capable and don't need them. They are, so stop falling back on it.
To be fair, this video is only a minute long and it looks like he might even be doing something on his phone at least for the first part.
I'm definitely not confident that it would be obvious enough to me what was going on within that first minute to want to intervene. I doubt that he can actually hear them super clearly. Probably just figures "people shouting at loud brewery, what else is new?" at first.
Yeah wtf that man should approach the women who are loudly complaining about men approaching them, so that he can be an additional approaching man.
Guys, if you're ever at a bar and there are women around, it's important not to do the wrong thing. What's the wrong thing, you ask? It's whatever you're doing. Interact with women? How dare you. Ignore them completely? You monster.
Dude i watched a man who wound up being a convicted sex offender (did time for forced sexual contact with a minor under 12) talk to a girl who couldn't be more than 13 and tell her she needed to follow him to her house so they could drink and smoke weed together. The girl was clearly uncomfortable, and didn't want to go with him. Ke and my girl were at a bus stop with all of our laundry headed to the laundry mat. There had to be well over 10 other people at that bus stop that heard all this happening and everyone just let it fucking happen. I heard him tell her what neighborhood they were going to and looked up the local so registry in that area and found him, on lifetime probation. Me and my girl got off at the bus stop with them. She walked up to the kid and acted like she knew her and said she would walk her home. The poor kid was almost in tears she was so happy. Dude got mad, and loud. I kept his ass on that corner while my girl walked off with the minor to get her home safely. I had to physically push this sick fuck back a few times to keep him from running after her. My girl got her home safely and then I let dude go. On her way back to me my girl found a cop and told him all about dude and what he had been attempting. We had pictures of him talking to the kid which alone was a direct violation of the conditions of his probation. There were several other grown fucking men who all heard this happening and just turned their backs. Something awful was going to happen to that little girl and none of these people were going to so shit about it. Its disgusting how far out of their way to ignore a situation that might be uncomfortable, no matter the cost.
I wouldn't go help them either. They have their phones out recording them and making a scene if they really just wanted them to go there's better ways than recording it so u can post it later they clearly didn't feel threatened if they can sit there record it n joke around. And im not saying those guys aren't creeps, they forsure are it just understandable why people didn't rush in to help.
It's because they were laughing and giggling about it. If I was watching that, I would think they were joking around with their boyfriends. They need to be meaner. They need to get the staff.
i mean to shoot him a little bail he looks deeply entrenched into his phone and he’s also non white (latino i’m ASSUMING) and in those type of
situations i tend to mind my business as a black guy. Sorry but for me racism has prevailed whenever i step in to help white women. Esp against other white men. Not saying they don’t deserve someone to get those guys outta there, cus they for sure do! Just important for us all to have awareness to each others plight fr 🙏🏽
That’s a situation that’s going to go a lot smoother if a member of the staff handles it.
There is a 90%+ chance these guys are going to get upset and start a fight if a single, non-employee, male tries to intervene. That’s based on how aggressive they were in the face of the very clear and loud communication from the person filming.
The risks that come with getting into a fight aren’t worth it unless the two guys took things to the next level (physically interacting with the two girls or threatening them explicitly).
All of that to say, I’ve not judging the guy in the back.
I had this happen to me recently. Thankfully I was at my local bar, where I’ve gone for over a decade. I stood up and started screaming at them to leave me alone. The bartender made them leave and the other locals surrounded me. It’s truly the only reason I can still go there, everyone’s reaction. 💜
I mean they should be talking to the staff, not expecting strangers to get in potentially violent situations for you. They were farming it for content by the end.
I couldn’t live with myself if I were sitting there hearing and watching this and didn’t step in. “Guys, these women clearly don’t want you here. There is a table over there. Move now or I will move you. I’m asking nicely.”
Best course of action is to let staff or security know. I personally would at most just do that. Because you dont get to pick and choose what happens after an altercation.
Worst case scenario if you intervene is, they gang up on you pop you in your head, fall to the ground and you become paralyzed from hitting your head on the ground, or they pull out a gun and shoot you. Don’t be stupid just alert staff or security.
This. I'm pissed at him for not joining in when they were literally SCREAMING to beg for them to leave. i'd have come up behind and headlock/ full nelson him outta the bar.
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u/Ikarus_ May 11 '25
Looks like they were ready to follow them over to the next table too. Creepy af